Who is responsible for the building internet?

Who is ultimately responsible for talking to the local ISP about issues? A few weeks ago we had an internet outage in one of our meeting houses. As the STS I tried to contact the ISP directly to get their help in resolving the issue. I was asked for an account number, which I did not have and it is not in the CNM record. I was asked my name and told it wasn't a contact they had in the record. I communicated with our local FM group and was told they don't do anything with the internet. I called STS/Global Services support and was told after a long hold that I needed to talk to our local FM group.

On another more pressing issue we are consistently getting (much) less than the recommended upload bandwidth in our stake building (as per CNM documentation; see attachment below). During the last stack conference our video stream froze for the remote ends multiple times and dropped completely during our stake president's talk. The remote chapels just said a closing prayer and sent the members home. Recently, our stake building was upgraded to the new HD AV standard equipment. We were using the older SD equipment provided to us by the church before. We were promised to get trained on this new equipment but it hasn't happened and now we have stake conference coming up in less than two weeks. Again, in trying to get our building's bandwidth upgraded I have run into the same "finger pointing" issue. The local FM group says that I need to talk to Global Services support. Global Services says I need to talk to the FM group. I don't know if this is part of a larger problem that we have with our FM group (e.g., the building I meet in is almost to the point it needs to be condemn: e.g., the 40+ year old roof is leaking everywhere, there is mold growing in the ceiling tiles, there was a gas leak in the building but now we haven't had hot water in the building all summer long, etc.).

Also, who is responsible for training us on the new AV equipment that was installed in our stake building about a month ago? I have been essentially "reverse engineering" what has been installed, pulling down manuals, following cables under the building, etc. In the process I have found that anyone on the building wifi (Liahona) can take control of this new system: change the volume settings, move the pulpit up and down, shut the system off, etc. Should we just shut off the building wifi to address this security problem?

Sounds like you should have the stake president have a little chat with the FM group.

FM orders the internet and handles the ISP.

As an STS, you can open a trouble ticket in FIR and report the problem. Your ticket will be visible to your PFR, FM manager, and quite a few others.

Mikerowaved wrote: Wed Nov 22, 2023 10:04 pm As an STS, you can open a trouble ticket in FIR and report the problem. Your ticket will be visible to your PFR, FM manager, and quite a few others.

True, but if their attitude is "they don't do anything with the internet", that may not get far. Correction "from below" may not work. But if the Stake President talks to the coordinating council, something might come down "from above".

But it's worth a shot before calling out the cavalry. Ask why is there an "Internet/phone" category in FIR if FM doesn't handle that.

There are people at Church HQ who handle ordering and paying the bills and what not. The FM Group would be the go-to people, and they in turn would communicate with the right department at church HQ. As a contractor for EMCOR Facilities, one of the contractors the church uses to handle facilities maintenance stuff outside of the states of Utah, Idaho, and Arizona (and maybe one other?) I get to help fix some of the issues we run into with building internet issues. In the past, the FM Groups here have provided me with an ISP account number and I have reached out to the ISP to work with them on getting things resolved, or being a point of contact that their techs can reach out to or what not. Sometimes various ISPs will require an authorized person on the account to talk to in which case I go back to the FM Group contact with church HQ to help out there.

What type of internet service do you have at your building? DSL? Cable? Satellite? Microwave? Cell?
I might be able to help get you in touch with someone who works for the church who can reach out to church HQ or your FM Group to help advise them on how to proceed.
Sometimes there are FMs who don't understand how it is supposed to work (or they were never trained or may be new)

A few more thoughts:

- There may not be better speeds available for that building/area depending on the infrastructure of the internet/telecom providers. I have a number of buildings that I work at that are lucky to get 10MB down and 2MB up. Rural areas and a few just far enough away that the ISP can't do any better right now. Starlink is slowly being authorized in some cases as a use for situations like this, but it takes time to get that authorized and installed.

I do strongly recommend you disable wifi during broadcasts where download and upload speeds need to be at their best.

As for the new A/V equipment- that should be going into your facility zone port on your Meraki switch, which means it should not be able to be accessed by anyone on wifi. (we always use Port 8 or the last port on the managed switch to designate as a facility zone and program that port as facility zone, and then add an unmanaged 4 or 6 port switch to that to have them connect additional facility stuff like key fob systems, sound systems, and what not to. there is likely a switch in the sound cabinet, that should connect to the facility zone port on the meraki as well. Facility zones can't be accessed by anything unless it too is plugged into the facility zone, or is accessed by someone that has church firewall/vpn access remotely. I'm assuming it's a QSC amplifier with digital LCD screens in the chapel and cultural hall and in the sound cabinet. configuration settings of that equipment (QSC) generally are not done by the members/STS, most of the stuff is programmed in and then locked. You should have control of the camera(s) and things like that... I would think that the FM Group could get the contractor who installed and setup the equipment to help train you if needed.

RyanGard1977 wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2023 12:35 am A few more thoughts:

- There may not be better speeds available for that building/area depending on the infrastructure of the internet/telecom providers. I have a number of buildings that I work at that are lucky to get 10MB down and 2MB up. Rural areas and a few just far enough away that the ISP can't do any better right now. Starlink is slowly being authorized in some cases as a use for situations like this, but it takes time to get that authorized and installed.

I do strongly recommend you disable wifi during broadcasts where download and upload speeds need to be at their best.

As for the new A/V equipment- that should be going into your facility zone port on your Meraki switch, which means it should not be able to be accessed by anyone on wifi. (we always use Port 8 or the last port on the managed switch to designate as a facility zone and program that port as facility zone, and then add an unmanaged 4 or 6 port switch to that to have them connect additional facility stuff like key fob systems, sound systems, and what not to. there is likely a switch in the sound cabinet, that should connect to the facility zone port on the meraki as well. Facility zones can't be accessed by anything unless it too is plugged into the facility zone, or is accessed by someone that has church firewall/vpn access remotely. I'm assuming it's a QSC amplifier with digital LCD screens in the chapel and cultural hall and in the sound cabinet. configuration settings of that equipment (QSC) generally are not done by the members/STS, most of the stuff is programmed in and then locked. You should have control of the camera(s) and things like that... I would think that the FM Group could get the contractor who installed and setup the equipment to help train you if needed.

The building is in the middle of Dallas and not in a rural area. We always disable the public wifi.

RyanGard1977 wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2023 12:27 am There are people at Church HQ who handle ordering and paying the bills and what not. The FM Group would be the go-to people, and they in turn would communicate with the right department at church HQ. As a contractor for EMCOR Facilities, one of the contractors the church uses to handle facilities maintenance stuff outside of the states of Utah, Idaho, and Arizona (and maybe one other?) I get to help fix some of the issues we run into with building internet issues. In the past, the FM Groups here have provided me with an ISP account number and I have reached out to the ISP to work with them on getting things resolved, or being a point of contact that their techs can reach out to or what not. Sometimes various ISPs will require an authorized person on the account to talk to in which case I go back to the FM Group contact with church HQ to help out there.

What type of internet service do you have at your building? DSL? Cable? Satellite? Microwave? Cell?
I might be able to help get you in touch with someone who works for the church who can reach out to church HQ or your FM Group to help advise them on how to proceed.
Sometimes there are FMs who don't understand how it is supposed to work (or they were never trained or may be new)

Cable broadband, which is part of the problem. We essentially share the cable with the neighborhood and they are home during the weekends using it.

RyanGard1977 wrote: Thu Nov 23, 2023 12:35 am
As for the new A/V equipment- that should be going into your facility zone port on your Meraki switch, which means it should not be able to be accessed by anyone on wifi. (we always use Port 8 or the last port on the managed switch to designate as a facility zone and program that port as facility zone, and then add an unmanaged 4 or 6 port switch to that to have them connect additional facility stuff like key fob systems, sound systems, and what not to. there is likely a switch in the sound cabinet, that should connect to the facility zone port on the meraki as well. Facility zones can't be accessed by anything unless it too is plugged into the facility zone, or is accessed by someone that has church firewall/vpn access remotely. I'm assuming it's a QSC amplifier with digital LCD screens in the chapel and cultural hall and in the sound cabinet. configuration settings of that equipment (QSC) generally are not done by the members/STS, most of the stuff is programmed in and then locked. You should have control of the camera(s) and things like that... I would think that the FM Group could get the contractor who installed and setup the equipment to help train you if needed.

They installed this new QSC amp w/ the digital LCD screens about a month ago. We have been asking for training before our stake conference this last Sunday but it never happened. The system is obviously not configured completely since we couldn't even get the choir mics to work. The remote sites could not hear anything of the music including the organ. It obvious that it has not been programed and locked because I can use the app to control everything. I get the same screens you see on all the LCD screens on my phone.

The other issue we had was with the visiting GA and his laptop for some slides he had. Apparently it was doing HDCP (as indicated on the box in the new equipment rack) which locked the video and made it a problem to stream. I read in the manual that the system can disable HDCP which a configuration change but just ended up doing an "analog" hack to remove the HDCP. The good news is we were just notified that we are getting trained this Friday.

I wished they didn't install the equipment until they could scheduled the training shortly after it was installed. It made doing stake conference a real nightmare and made me question if I want to continue in my calling as STS.