Kindoo Access Control System

The FM group is installing a new access control system from Kindoo Technologies. (See https://www.kindoo.tech). To use this system you need to install an application on your iPhone or Android phone. Part of installation is to agree to their terms and conditions. (https://www.kindoo.tech/terms-of-use) My concern is that this agreement is overly broad and refers to "you" as if you were the subscriber of the service (which probably is the FM group) instead of the proper context as that of the user of the service.

Is there a separate written agreement that the church has entered into that supersedes the agreement that members are being asked to agree to on behalf of the church or themselves to use this software? If so does anyone have a copy of it?

Thanks.

dave.swartz wrote: Thu Feb 23, 2023 9:36 pm Is there a separate written agreement that the church has entered into that supersedes the agreement that members are being asked to agree to on behalf of the church or themselves to use this software? If so does anyone have a copy of it?

I expect that there is, because the terms you link to require payment per user if there are more than two of them and I do not believe the Church would agree to that. As written, I would not be able to commit to the terms of the agreement to which you linked.

It should be an interesting adoption process.

I also suppose the FM Group will be swapping out door locks every five years along with computers.

And to use the system it appears I have to be on the Internet and have Bluetooth activated on my phone. I wonder if I can connect to Liahona to do it?

Not to mention having a phone that will do the trick. And electricity.

Kindoo is rolling out in our FM group. It's a very clever system and is working well. We have it on our buildings. The license agreement has some components between Kindoo and the Church and between Kindoo and the end user. The Church has negotiated a discounted user fee and it's paid by the FM group. The end user needs to authorize the app to use Bluetooth, as that is how it communicates with the device to unlock the door. The phone needs internet access because Kindoo is a cloud-based service. You initially authenticate through the Kindoo app using the Church's single sign-on (matching the email address stored in your membership record). That's a one-time action. Then, when you approach a Kindoo-enabled door, the app detects it via Bluetooth and displays an onscreen "Open" button. If you are authorized for that door at that time of day, there is an encrypted handshake between the phone and the Kindoo device which unlocks the door.
The phone needs internet access, but you can use the Liahona network for that.
The Kindoo is powered by a battery backup power supply, so still works if power is lost. One door of the building is still keyed. In our area, stake presidents and bishops will have that key as a backup entry method. A key still needs to be in the Knox box for emergency services access to the building.
I've been involved in the installation and training process for our FM group and am happy to answer any questions.

swigginton wrote: Fri Feb 24, 2023 9:11 am I've been involved in the installation and training process for our FM group and am happy to answer any questions.

I'd like to know what the end user agreement for the users are. Article 6.1 seems overly broad.

russellhltn wrote: Fri Feb 24, 2023 10:31 am

swigginton wrote: Fri Feb 24, 2023 9:11 am I've been involved in the installation and training process for our FM group and am happy to answer any questions.

I'd like to know what the end user agreement for the users are. Article 6.1 seems overly broad.

That's a pretty standard clause for most apps. For Kindoo, they collect your email address. When you authenticate through the Church sign-on, they collect your name as it exists in the Church membership record. You can choose to upload a self photo, but that's optional. A Kindoo manager or administrator can also add a description. In our case, it's the member's calling. You can also add your phone number, but that's also optional. They collect your phone type so they can provide the correct user interface controls, etc.

Everyone,
Here is the latest update on this. I reached out to Kindoo and was put in contact with the vendor that is working with the church deploying this application. I had a great conversation with their CEO and expressed my concerns with their agreement. He agrees that the agreement presented when enrolling your device is the wrong agreement for end users to be agreeing to. He will work with Kindoo to get this resolved. They are planning a new release in 3 weeks of the App and he hopes that in that release this will be fixed. He meets regularly with church ICS and he will surface this with them as well.

It sounds like this is a good system. I would chalk this up to normal speed bumps that happen anytime a new system is deployed. It will be interesting to see how this system works going forward.

All the best.

Slightly changing the topic: does the Church use the Kindoo system solely for external doors? There's rumblings that our local building may be in line for electronic keys in the coming months, and we're interested in determining exactly how much reduction in physical keys we should expect. We have the normal interior keys for library, clerks office, and Branch President office. We also have an external shed which operates on the same key as the external building doors. There's a lot of overlap between those needing building access and those needing access to those other doors, so if somebody with this system could confirm how the Church is implementing the electronic keys, that will help us get an idea of how many of us will actually be able to go truly "keyless".

BrianEdwards wrote: Mon Feb 27, 2023 9:20 am ...does the Church use the Kindoo system solely for external doors?"

For our FM group, it's only external doors (1 to 3 doors, depending on the building configuration and whether there is a separate stake office entry). You still have physical keys for the material center, offices, outside gates, font, closets, shed, etc. You need to run low-voltage power to the doors, install electric strikes, etc. It's not an inexpensive solution and not intended to be fully keyless; just a better way to manage building access.

@swigginton On our Kindoo system one door can be unlocked remotely. I'm assuming this means there is a device on the church building network that has Bluetooth capability. Do you know what that device is and what it looks like? I've been asked to power cycle one and and would LOVE to know what I'm looking for

bilges wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 10:56 am @swigginton On our Kindoo system one door can be unlocked remotely. I'm assuming this means there is a device on the church building network that has Bluetooth capability.

I'm not sure that's a valid conclusion. It might be done over the internet via WiFi.

russellhltn wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 11:58 am

bilges wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 10:56 am @swigginton On our Kindoo system one door can be unlocked remotely. I'm assuming this means there is a device on the church building network that has Bluetooth capability.

I'm not sure that's a valid conclusion. It might be done over the internet via WiFi.

The Kin D devices use Bluetooth. Regardless, the assumption is valid that there is a network device (hardwired or WiFi but pretty sure it’s hardwired). I need to find that device. If anyone knows what it looks like I’d appreciate a description

bilges wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 10:56 am @swigginton On our Kindoo system one door can be unlocked remotely. I'm assuming this means there is a device on the church building network that has Bluetooth capability. Do you know what that device is and what it looks like? I've been asked to power cycle one and and would LOVE to know what I'm looking for

Yes, there is an option to install a device called a "Kin Controller" at a location to remotely unlock a door. It is a Raspberry Pi that has been programmed with specific software from Kindoo, and has a unique ID. It is hardwired to the building network and transmits an encrypted Bluetooth signal to unlock a nearby Kindoo door. It sort of simulates using a mobile phone to unlock the door. For our FM group, only the FM manager and Kindoo installer have access to remotely unlock a door. The controller device itself is a Raspberry Pi in a CanaKit case. It will have a sticker on it, identifying it as a "Kin Controller", along with it's serial number. Just Google this and you'll see what it looks like:
CanaKit - Premium Case for Raspberry Pi 4 - Black

swigginton wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 4:29 pm

bilges wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 10:56 am @swigginton On our Kindoo system one door can be unlocked remotely. I'm assuming this means there is a device on the church building network that has Bluetooth capability. Do you know what that device is and what it looks like? I've been asked to power cycle one and and would LOVE to know what I'm looking for

Yes, there is an option to install a device called a "Kin Controller" at a location to remotely unlock a door. It is a Raspberry Pi that has been programmed with specific software from Kindoo, and has a unique ID. It is hardwired to the building network and transmits an encrypted Bluetooth signal to unlock a nearby Kindoo door. It sort of simulates using a mobile phone to unlock the door. For our FM group, only the FM manager and Kindoo installer have access to remotely unlock a door. The controller device itself is a Raspberry Pi in a CanaKit case. It will have a sticker on it, identifying it as a "Kin Controller", along with it's serial number. Just Google this and you'll see what it looks like:
CanaKit - Premium Case for Raspberry Pi 4 - Black

One more thing...in our case, most of the controllers are powered by a PoE splitter. Others are plugged into a nearby outlet. If it's PoE powered, you could reset it by unplugging from the switch instead of trying to track down the controller device.

russellhltn wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 11:58 am

bilges wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 10:56 am @swigginton On our Kindoo system one door can be unlocked remotely. I'm assuming this means there is a device on the church building network that has Bluetooth capability.

I'm not sure that's a valid conclusion. It might be done over the internet via WiFi.

Found it. It was in ceiling. Raspberry Pi 4
https://vilros.com/products/vilros-rasp ... onnect-fan

Ugh. Fan cooled and stuck in the ceiling. Not a good combination for longevity.

Kindoo system in our building has the following components, that I have been able to find. Electronic door striker and controller that interfaces with a member's phone over Bluetooth. A second circuit board in an enclosure. In our case this was mounted in a furnace room. This device then has a network connection to the core switch to allow it to access the Internet.

dave.swartz wrote: Tue May 02, 2023 11:27 am Kindoo system in our building has the following components, that I have been able to find. Electronic door striker and controller that interfaces with a member's phone over Bluetooth. A second circuit board in an enclosure. In our case this was mounted in a furnace room. This device then has a network connection to the core switch to allow it to access the Internet.

The components needed for a Kindoo installation are:

1. KIN-D device (a small module that receives the Bluetooth communication and controls the electric strike. Installed somewhere near the door. We've typically put them in foyer soffits or inside the door frame.
2. Electric strike (can typically re-use existing strikes and wiring from previous electronic access systems)
3. Power supply - 12/24VDC battery-backed up power supply to power the KIN-D devices and strikes. Typically centrally located in a mechanical room, etc.
4. Cable (typically 4-wire) to route from the power supply to the KIN-D's.
5. KIN Controller (optional) which allows those authorized to remotely unlock the door. Connected via Cat6 cable to the network switch and powered either by a plug-in USB-C power supply or PoE splitter. This is the Raspberry Pi device discussed earlier in this thread

For the individual talking with FM and the Kindoo CEO, it would be helpful if this app could enable other users 1x access rights. The use case is building cleaning (if ward members are coming to help earlier or later than the overall group) or building lock up.

bradleyturnerj wrote: Sat Aug 05, 2023 5:44 pm For the individual talking with FM and the Kindoo CEO, it would be helpful if this app could enable other users 1x access rights. The use case is building cleaning (if ward members are coming to help earlier or later than the overall group) or building lock up.

The Kindoo app has the ability to add "temporary" users. You add the user and set a date/time when the access expires. Seems like that could cover what you are requesting. We use it for family activities, wedding receptions and other one-time use situations.

We just installed it into one of our buildings, with the old Keypad system that died and could not find a board to replace it.
We ran into a few problems.
1st I found out at 2 pm that we were moving to this system. It was up and running by 6 pm the same day. As long as you have a CSV list with E-mail and calling and for that needs access, will do fine. In my case, it was a stake center 3 ward & Stake. I started with the list of members who had door codes That list did not have email. I could not get a report out of LCR as a starting point (the Stake Clerk was not around), so I ended up using the map/directory, online. With the CVS file, you can upload 50 at a time. That went very quickly. Start updating your list now.

2nd It unlocks the doors for a few seconds, so if your old door were set to auto-lock, you will now need to lock and unlock the panic hardware

3rd At this point Kindoo app is not an approved app for the missionaries. SL Mission Dept is beta testing at this time, No ETA on rollout.

When you set up members it will automatically send out an email, with a link to the app. Quite a few thought it was spam. Give them a heads-up that it is coming. In your email. send them the you tube video on how to set it up and use it.

Quick question. Our stake is saying the remote access capability is not available. I’ve read the other threads and can see that a ‘Kin Controller” (essentially a Raspberry Pi programed with Kindoo software to simulate a mobile phone) is installed for such remote access. My question is: is this an optional remote opening capability and our Stake may have ‘opted out’ of this feature? Between the evening Family Search Center workers and a couple of dozen Activity Day leaders (we have four large family wards in this building), remote access may be the only way around the 30 code limitation our stake is placing on the wards. Any thoughts?

The Kindoo controller is optional. We stopped installing them in our FM group because they proved unreliable and were not really needed with the ability to have temporary users. We also specify 50 users for stake leadership and 30 for each ward. So far that has been more than sufficient. You can see in the Kindoo app which users are not using the app. Typically, about 20-30% of users seem to fall into that category. We instruct the stake Kindoo managers to verify whether those users intend to use (or need) the app. If not, they can be removed and the license transferred to another user.

Our Stake is just now getting the Kindoo installed. Does anyone have any kind of training materials for this system? Any documentation on how it works would be great. I have been getting mixed messages on who can get access. They have not even granted me admin access yet and already getting questions and our local Facilities Rep is saying one thing and those installing the system is saying something different.

mmacconnell wrote: Thu Jul 11, 2024 5:35 pm Does anyone have any kind of training materials for this system? Any documentation on how it works would be great.

Your FM group should be providing training. They will work with your stake leaders to determine who should have "Manager" access, which lets you manage users in the system for your stake. Only the FM group will have "Admin" access. I do the Kindoo training for our FM group and created documentation, but it's specific to the policies our FM group has established. Yours might be different. If you have specific questions about the functionality of Kindoo, I'm happy to answer.

Your FM group should be providing training. They will work with your stake leaders to determine who should have "Manager" access, which lets you manage users in the system for your stake. Only the FM group will have "Admin" access. I do the Kindoo training for our FM group and created documentation, but it's specific to the policies our FM group has established. Yours might be different. If you have specific questions about the functionality of Kindoo, I'm happy to answer.

From what I am getting is that as the Stake Techology Specialist is that I will be admin. But maybe they are just getting the terminology mixed up since they are not tech savvy. They are telling me that only those in specific callings will have access, and that for all events it must be someone in one of those callings. But I see in this discussion you can assign temp access to someone.

From what I've heard, I expect it to allow temporary access. But hopefully someone besides the STS can administer that.

mmacconnell wrote: Thu Jul 11, 2024 6:25 pm From what I am getting is that as the Stake Techology Specialist is that I will be admin. But maybe they are just getting the terminology mixed up since they are not tech savvy. They are telling me that only those in specific callings will have access, and that for all events it must be someone in one of those callings. But I see in this discussion you can assign temp access to someone.

Yeah, Admin access lets you buy licenses for the stake and create managers. Only FM will have access to that. People in the stake will have Manager access. For our area, it's typically the STS who manages the users for the stake. We have them assign at least 2 people per stake as managers, so they have a backup person. It should not be done at a ward level, since the managers have access to all users in the stake.
Yes, you will be allotted a specific number of licenses for your stake. For our FM group it's 50 for stake leaders plus 30 per ward. Your FM group may choose a different number. That's been sufficient for all our stakes.
Yes, you can assign temporary users, so many stakes will have their building scheduler as a Kindoo manager. That's what we do in our stake. They only assign temporary users. Our stake STS handles all the permanent users.
FYI, sometime in the 3rd quarter of this year, Kindoo will be integrated with LCR. As people move in and out of callings, they will automatically get/lose Kindoo access. I'm not sure exactly how it will work, but I've provided my recommendations.

swigginton wrote: Thu Jul 11, 2024 7:03 pm FYI, sometime in the 3rd quarter of this year, Kindoo will be integrated with LCR. As people move in and out of callings, they will automatically get/lose Kindoo access.

And I'm sure once again, those who are not in a standard position won't have Kindoo right - at least not automatically.

russellhltn wrote: Thu Jul 11, 2024 7:19 pm And I'm sure once again, those who are not in a standard position won't have Kindoo right - at least not automatically.

If they implement it in the way I proposed, any calling (standard or non-standard) can be linked to Kindoo access. We'll see...

bilges wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 10:56 am @swigginton On our Kindoo system one door can be unlocked remotely. I'm assuming this means there is a device on the church building network that has Bluetooth capability. Do you know what that device is and what it looks like? I've been asked to power cycle one and and would LOVE to know what I'm looking for

Can you share how you do that? We recently got Kindoo system in our building. I’m trying to set it up where I can unlock our church main door from home for individuals going to clean at a certain time. I know I can set a time period if I’m within the KIN range but can I do that from home as well and it will work? How can you get it to work remotely? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

OliverW.86 wrote: Fri Jul 19, 2024 4:47 pm

bilges wrote: Thu Apr 27, 2023 10:56 am @swigginton On our Kindoo system one door can be unlocked remotely. I'm assuming this means there is a device on the church building network that has Bluetooth capability. Do you know what that device is and what it looks like? I've been asked to power cycle one and and would LOVE to know what I'm looking for

Can you share how you do that? We recently got Kindoo system in our building. I’m trying to set it up where I can unlock our church main door from home for individuals going to clean at a certain time. I know I can set a time period if I’m within the KIN range but can I do that from home as well and it will work? How can you get it to work remotely? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

There are a few different options, which depend on a few different things:

• If they also installed a Kindoo Controller (a Raspberry Pi box with custom software hardwired to the network), it can signal the kindoo door to unlock. We moved away from those, since they were not very reliable. You can remotely tell the controller to unlock the door. You can also define a schedule to have the door unlock at a specific time. Not a great idea, in my opinion, since you don't know for sure that a trusted person is at the door when it unlocks.
• To tell the controller to unlock, you need to be a Kindoo manager and the admin needs to have configured the site such that managers can access the controllers. We disabled that capability on all our sites so only admins could remotely unlock.
• For building cleaning, it's probably better to set up temporary users. You can choose start/end dates and times for their kindoo access. They can then use the app to unlock the building within that time frame. After their time expires, the user license goes back into the pool of available licenses.

swigginton wrote: Fri Jul 19, 2024 5:23 pm You can also define a schedule to have the door unlock at a specific time. Not a great idea, in my opinion, since you don't know for sure that a trusted person is at the door when it unlocks.

True. It's tempting to tell it to unlock each Sunday, but then there's General Conference, Stake Conference, and extreme weather days.

swigginton wrote: Fri Jul 19, 2024 5:23 pm For building cleaning, it's probably better to set up temporary users. You can choose start/end dates and times for their kindoo access. They can then use the app to unlock the building within that time frame. After their time expires, the user license goes back into the pool of available licenses.

I wonder what happens to the license if they're put on a repeating schedule - like every Saturday? Is it freed up on other days of the week?

russellhltn wrote: Fri Jul 19, 2024 6:05 pm I wonder what happens to the license if they're put on a repeating schedule - like every Saturday? Is it freed up on other days of the week?

You can't configure a repeating schedule for a temporary user. You can only set the start and end dates/times. As soon as you configure that user, the license is removed from the pool to ensure it will be available at the start time, but they won't have access until that time arrives. When the end time arrives, the license is returned to the pool and the user is removed from the site.

swigginton wrote: Fri Jul 19, 2024 6:11 pm You can't configure a repeating schedule for a temporary user.

Does it allow repeating schedules for non-temporary users? I'd think it would have to unless all authorized users are able to open at anytime.

russellhltn wrote: Fri Jul 19, 2024 7:19 pm Does it allow repeating schedules for non-temporary users? I'd think it would have to unless all authorized users are able to open at anytime.

Yes. You configure "Access rules" to define when users can unlock a building. They can be simple or fairly complex. You can configure multiple time blocks during specific days of the week when users are permitted to enter. You can also configure holidays or special events when users are permitted to enter the building or prevented from entering. For example, you could prevent members from entering when the building is scheduled for carpet cleaning.
For our FM group, we configure general members to have access from 5AM-11PM daily. Bishoprics, stake presidency, PFR, security specialists have 24x7 access. You also configure which buildings within the stake are accessible to which members by assigning specific access rules. It's very flexible. For example, stake leaders have access to all buildings. Ward leaders have access to their own building. Exceptions are easy to configure. We give the ward mission leader access to their own building, but also to the stake center so they have access to the baptismal font.

Glad to know. I'm not sure if it will show up at my stake center given that it's a historic building, but I am hearing that the system will be rolled out more broadly.

You will need to talk to the system's admin or your FM group. An add-on may need to be installed to open doors remotely.
As for the power cycle, You may want to look where your old kek pad system is; ours takes power off of that. or reach out to the installer.

Trying to get a little clarification on how the licenses work and our FM group is not responsive. Does anyone know when the licenses are issued, are they specific to a building or do they all go into a larger pool for the whole Stake. Right now we only have one building but others are being scheduled. Reason for asking, some of our High Councilors are asking if they can have access to other buildings, but before we give an answer we need to find out if the licenses are specific to buildings. The Stake President wants me to check on that before he decides if we will allow access outside our Stake Center for some of these callings.

mmacconnell wrote: Tue Sep 03, 2024 5:32 pm ...when the licenses are issued, are they specific to a building or do they all go into a larger pool for the whole Stake.

The licenses are issued to a stake in a pool for distribution among ward and stake leaders. The meetinghouses for the stake are grouped within a stake "site". The Kindoo manager assigns the meetinghouses/doors/times for each user. So, a ward leader typically has access to their own building. Stake leaders could have access to all buildings. Either users occupies only 1 user license from the stake pool.

Thanks, that confirms what I was thinking would happen. Just needed that final confirmation before we finalize the procedures for our Stake. There does not seem to be much in the way of documentation on who “officially” gets access so we are kind of playing it by ear. Our Stake Center is the next building scheduled to get this system in a month or two so Stake Presidency is trying to document everything and present to the Stake Council during our next meeting.

mmacconnell wrote: Tue Sep 03, 2024 5:47 pm There does not seem to be much in the way of documentation on who “officially” gets access so we are kind of playing it by ear.

That's unfortunate. Our FM group provides 1 hour training and documentation to a stake presidency counselor, PFR and STS (who is typically the Kindoo manager). We include a list of recommended ward/stake leaders to receive licenses. That effort has made the process incredibly smooth and reduces the number of follow-up questions/issues. I've done that for more than a dozen stakes so far and it's gone extremely well.

If there is anyone viewing this discussion for Kindoo Access Control System, who has had to migrate from the Sicunet system (Open Cesamee app) that also supports FOBs, I would really like to get some insight of the transition process and how loosing the FOB functionality was dealt with.
I/we really don't want to be forced to transition to Kindoo since I just spent the past two years and hundreds of hrs. getting the Sicunet system running smoothly.
The Kindoo costs $20 per licence for each user is quite steep in comparison to unlimited users in the Sicunet system for free and .25 Cents per FOB.
400+ Kindoo licences at $20 is $8000+, plus installation costs, plus all of the time it will take to setup an entire Stake of 9 wards and 2 branches in a new system.

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Sep 18, 2024 10:59 am If there is anyone viewing this discussion for Kindoo Access Control System, who has had to migrate from the Sicunet system (Open Cesamee app) that also supports FOBs, I would really like to get some insight of the transition process and how loosing the FOB functionality was dealt with.

I not familiar with that specific system, but have installed Kindoo to replace other FOB systems. Depending on the available cabling, it may be possible to run both systems in parallel for a while during the transition. I've been able to do that with a few sites, but not all. It's up to your FM manager, since it requires at least 2 trips for the installer.
Configuring users is fairly easy. You can import A csv file of users. If you can export from your existing FOB system, it will give you a jump start.
I agree it's a hassle to convert when you've worked so hard on an existing system, but it will be nice to have consistency. I've replaced a half dozen different brands of entry systems with Kindoo. With the LCR integration, user management will become much easier.
Let me know if you have specific questions about the process, I can try to answer those.

I not familiar with that specific system, but have installed Kindoo to replace other FOB systems.

Just to clarify, the Sicunet eLock system is not just a FOB system. It is both a smartphone app based system along with the functionality of using FOBs. 85% + of our members use the smartphone app Open Cesamee. It is a new system only several years old and it works very well.
There are several situations that FOBs work better:
We have a number of leaders and a bishop who are technically challenged and do not use smartphones, or still use a flip phone. We have around 50-60 FOBs assigned to these members.
Agent Bishops use FOBs for the rotating schedule of wards and brothers who perform building lockup each night.
For family activities, Building Schedulers have a FOB that they lend to the family for their activity.
The Full time missionaries assigned to our Stake have a FOB for Bldg access.
A FOB is used for pickleball practice since the coordinator can't always be there.
Having to constantly configure temp access instead of using FOBs will increase the amount of admin time.

but it will be nice to have consistency.

Yes, it's easy to say that, but losing the functionality to additionally use FOBs is extremely frustrating.

Configuring users is fairly easy

So is the Sicunet system, but having to start all over and build a new system will be a huge investment in time. So many users need one on one help to get things to work.
Someone did some kind of seriously amazing sales job with the church to get them to make a blanket decision to force everyone to change to Kindoo.

Are there any types/brands of cellphones that don't work well with the Kindoo app?
Is there any youtube videos for training?
Is there any other training documentation available?
Does a user like a Stake Pres have to be configured in seperate controllers for each building, or does one controller do all the buildings in a stake?
Thanks,
Brother Hawkes

I can only give you my experience in transitioning these systems. Many had exactly the same concerns you expressed and are now doing fine with Kindoo. Yeah, it's a change and sometimes change is difficult. I'll give you my perspective from an installer and as a stake presidency counselor. Kindoo is elegantly simple to install and use. I've installed it in over a dozen stakes and it's working well. We love it in our stake. Yes, you need a mobile phone with either ios or android to install the app. Even older users who had doubts are using it regularly. Our building scheduler finds it much easier to not deliver physical keys to temporary users. We have fewer problems of kids borrowing parent's keys/fobs to get in the building without approval. Overall, it's solved a lot of problems for us, but that's just my experience.
Yes there is documentation and videos provided by the Church Kindoo rep, but we also created our own user guides, specific to our FM group.

Our building scheduler finds it much easier to not deliver physical keys to temporary users

So who all do you give admin rights to, so they can add/remove users for Bldg access?
Is it just one Stake Bldg Scheduler, or does each agent bishop call a building Scheduler that gets admin rights to add/remove users for an individual Bldg?

If a user has two phones, can the user put the app on both phones with their one account?

What is the process when a user gets a new phone?

The stake determines who has manager rights to add users. Typically, it's the STS for general users and building schedulers for temp users.
If you log in to your account from a different phone, it disables the app on the previous phone, so no, you can't have the account active on 2 phones at once. If you get a new phone, you just log in to the app on the new phone and it transfers the license to the new phone (after giving you a warning that it will disable the app on the old phone).

swigginton wrote: Wed Sep 18, 2024 3:48 pm The stake determines who has manager rights to add users. Typically, it's the STS for general users and building schedulers for temp users.
If you log in to your account from a different phone, it disables the app on the previous phone, so no, you can't have the account active on 2 phones at once. If you get a new phone, you just log in to the app on the new phone and it transfers the license to the new phone (after giving you a warning that it will disable the app on the old phone).

Thanks, I apprecate your insight and help.

Does the smartphone have to have internet connectivity each time the Kindoo app unlocks a door?

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Sep 18, 2024 8:11 pm Does the smartphone have to have internet connectivity each time the Kindoo app unlocks a door?

It uses Bluetooth. I think they said 20 feet, but have tested how far away you can get myself.

mmacconnell wrote: Wed Sep 18, 2024 8:16 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Sep 18, 2024 8:11 pm Does the smartphone have to have internet connectivity each time the Kindoo app unlocks a door?

It uses Bluetooth. I think they said 20 feet, but have tested how far away you can get myself.

Right, I understand that the phone uses bluetooth to communicate with the door sensor, but does the phone also need internet connectivity as part of the authentication to unlock the door?

I've got a question. It's been mentioned that the system supports callings. Can it support a custom calling (like "Hymn book straightener"?), or can it only deal with standard positions?

While I know it can support individuals, it would be nice if rights could be revoked when they leave a custom calling that required access.

I forgot to answer this question for you:

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Sep 18, 2024 1:06 pm Does a user like a Stake Pres have to be configured in seperate controllers for each building, or does one controller do all the buildings in a stake?

No. The brains of Kindoo is in a cloud-based server, so nothing is configured on the Kindoo device itself. Each stake is configure as a Kindoo "Site". Any user within that site is given access to whichever doors are appropriate. Kindoo uses "Access Rules" to group this information. For example, we configure 4 access rules per building:

• "Stake-Always" - anyone with this access rule has access to all buildings in the stake 24/7. Typically stake presidency, stake PFR, security specialists, etc.
• "Stake-Schedule" - all other stake leaders. They can access any building between 5AM-11pm
• "<building>-Always" - can access a specific building 24/7. Typically bishoprics, building PFR, security, etc.
• <building>-Schedule" - for all other building leaders. Can access a specific building between 5AM-11PM.

So, to configure a stake president, you just assign the "Stake-Always" rule and they automatically have access to all their buildings, even as new ones are added to Kindoo.

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Sep 18, 2024 8:11 pm Does the smartphone have to have internet connectivity each time the Kindoo app unlocks a door?

Yes, Internet connectivity is required. It can either be through the phone provider or you can use the building Wi-Fi. I understand the Church was going to bypass the firewall for Kindoo commands so you don't need first pass the TOS screen, but I haven't tested that.

russellhltn wrote: Wed Sep 18, 2024 8:30 pm I've got a question. It's been mentioned that the system supports callings. Can it support a custom calling (like "Hymn book straightener"?), or can it only deal with standard positions?

When I provided my input, I specifically suggested that any calling be configurable with Kindoo. If they do that, it should handle automatic Kindoo access transfer when a calling changes.

swigginton wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 8:27 am

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Sep 18, 2024 8:11 pm Does the smartphone have to have internet connectivity each time the Kindoo app unlocks a door?

Yes, Internet connectivity is required. It can either be through the phone provider or you can use the building Wi-Fi. I understand the Church was going to bypass the firewall for Kindoo commands so you don't need first pass the TOS screen, but I haven't tested that.

Our current Sicunet (Open Cesamee app) system, does not require both Bluetooth and internet connectivity on the phone to unlock a door, it only requires Bluetooth.
What additional issues/problems have users reported when trying to unlock a door with the Kindoo app and it won't unlock because the phone isn't getting both types of communication?

the Church was going to bypass the firewall for Kindoo commands so you don't need first pass the TOS screen, but I haven't tested that.

I know what a firewall is, but what does "you don't need first pass the TOS screen," mean? I've not seen the Kindoo app yet, maybe it would make more sense if I had.

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 4:37 pm Our current Sicunet (Open Cesamee app) system, does not require both Bluetooth and internet connectivity on the phone to unlock a door, it only requires Bluetooth.
What additional issues/problems have users reported when trying to unlock a door with the Kindoo app and it won't unlock because the phone isn't getting both types of communication?

Our original concerns were with buildings in areas with poor cell coverage, but even then, the coverage seems to be sufficient. The communication protocol is so small it doesn't require high bandwidth.

I know what a firewall is, but what does "you don't need first pass the TOS screen," mean? I've not seen the Kindoo app yet, maybe it would make more sense if I had.

TOS=Terms-of-service screen that the church requires you to accept before you get access to the Liahona network. I understand they were going to let the Kindoo traffic pass through without requiring the extra step of accepting that screen.

Reading this Kindoo web page, it indicates that there is a monthly fee per user seat (I assume that means license)
https://www.kindoo.tech/
I understand that the church gets a discount so each license is $20 instead of $25.
That is still all quite expensive as this system gets installed. 1,000,000 license's will cost $20,000,000 and the monthy fee will be $600,000.
Let me know if I'm misunderstanding something here.

Additional permanent user seat
25$
One-time fee per user seat

Additional monthly user seat
0.6$
Monthly fee per user seat

I'm sure the accounting department has done the math.

Balance that against parodic re-keying when a key is stolen or "too many keys are out there". The cost of the misuse of keys, and the more expensive locks the church has used to prevent keys from being duplicated.

ELHawkes wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 7:31 pm Reading this Kindoo web page, it indicates that there is a monthly fee per user seat (I assume that means license)

While Kindoo has a monthly license option, that's not what the Church is using. FM groups are required to purchase permanent one-time licenses, which the Church gets at a discount ($20/license). These licenses are permanently assigned to the stakes.

swigginton wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 8:14 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Sat Sep 21, 2024 7:31 pm Reading this Kindoo web page, it indicates that there is a monthly fee per user seat (I assume that means license)

While Kindoo has a monthly license option, that's not what the Church is using. FM groups are required to purchase permanent one-time licenses, which the Church gets at a discount ($20/license). These licenses are permanently assigned to the stakes.

I see, so where it said "additional" , I took that to mean that was in addition to the permanent licenses.
So it's actually one or the other of the two options.

I guess I still have a hard time with having a brand new Sicunet eLock system that was just installed in our Stake Apr 2023 and the cost was around 15k, and it works just fine, just to turn around and replace it already with a different system and spent another 10-15k.
Anyway thanks for helping me with all of my questions.

swigginton wrote: Thu Sep 19, 2024 8:27 am

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Sep 18, 2024 8:11 pm Does the smartphone have to have internet connectivity each time the Kindoo app unlocks a door?

Yes, Internet connectivity is required. It can either be through the phone provider or you can use the building Wi-Fi. I understand the Church was going to bypass the firewall for Kindoo commands so you don't need first pass the TOS screen, but I haven't tested that.

One other question,
In addition to having to have both Bluetooth and Internet connectivity enabled, does the Kindoo app also require Location services to be on/enabled?

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Sep 22, 2024 1:03 pm In addition to having to have both Bluetooth and Internet connectivity enabled, does the Kindoo app also require Location services to be on/enabled?

I does ask for location permission, but I'm not sure why. I asked about that a while ago and was told they don't use it, so not sure why it's needed.

swigginton wrote: Sun Sep 22, 2024 1:25 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Sep 22, 2024 1:03 pm In addition to having to have both Bluetooth and Internet connectivity enabled, does the Kindoo app also require Location services to be on/enabled?

I does ask for location permission, but I'm not sure why. I asked about that a while ago and was told they don't use it, so not sure why it's needed.

Okay, thanks.
We'll have to experiment once we get the new system installed and see what happens when location services is turned off or on.

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Sep 22, 2024 2:05 pm

swigginton wrote: Sun Sep 22, 2024 1:25 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Sep 22, 2024 1:03 pm In addition to having to have both Bluetooth and Internet connectivity enabled, does the Kindoo app also require Location services to be on/enabled?

I does ask for location permission, but I'm not sure why. I asked about that a while ago and was told they don't use it, so not sure why it's needed.

Okay, thanks.
We'll have to experiment once we get the new system installed and see what happens when location services is turned off or on.

So I asked my daughter that is in a stake in southern Utah that is using Kindoo to see what happens when she turned off location services on her phone.
When she truned it off, the Kindoo app gave her a message that said it needed to be truned on for BLE (Bluetooh Low Energy) and that the Kindoo app itself doesn't use it.
That got me courious since the Sicunet Open Cesamee app also uses BLE. So I truned location services off on my phone and tried unlocking a door. The Open Cesamee app didn't give me any message, but it would not unlock the door until I turned the location services back on.
Now I know another possibility why a small handfull of users could not get the app to unlock a door even though everything appeared to be setup correctly.

Another intresting thing I found in talking with the FT missionaries today, and in reading the instructions they were given for using Kindoo by the Ogden UT Mission, is that they are also instructed to install the Chrome browser on their phone and make it the default browser. I sure hope that is not a requirement in general for Stake users too.

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Sep 22, 2024 2:56 pm When she truned it off, the Kindoo app gave her a message that said it needed to be truned on for BLE (Bluetooh Low Energy) and that the Kindoo app itself doesn't use it.

Yeah, a quick Google search tells me location services are required for BLE, so that answers that question.

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Sep 22, 2024 2:56 pm Another intresting thing I found in talking with the FT missionaries today, and in reading the instructions they were given for using Kindoo by the Ogden UT Mission, is that they are also instructed to install the Chrome browser on their phone and make it the default browser. I sure hope that is not a requirement in general for Stake users too.

I've never seen or heard of any issues related to the browser from any of the 3000+ Kindoo users in our area. Kindoo does use the Church's single sign-on for initial authentication. I don't know if that's done through a browser, but certainly should not require Chrome exclusively. I just checked the official Kindoo document for our missionaries and it doesn't include any browser instructions. The 2 requirements for the missionaries in the Ogden mission may be unrelated.

So, is the plan to give all who now have 'authorized' physical keys to the building Kindoo access?

I'm a Ward clerk and just learned today that I am also a Kindoo 'manager'. People are starting to ask me for access.

I've set up the Bishops counselor who is also the building person. However, I want to fully understand the intent before I go too much further.

When reading about the system I saw that there is a cost per user.

MurdockM wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 6:19 pm So, is the plan to give all who now have 'authorized' physical keys to the building Kindoo access?

Building access is determined by the stake president, so it's ultimately up to him. For us, our FM group is providing a list of recommended leaders who should receive access. In Kindoo, access rules are configured for each building and for the stake leaders. The Kindoo managers assign those rules to the appropriate ward/stake leaders. Once things are stable with Kindoo, the locks get changed. Only the stake presidency, PFR and security folks get physical keys (which unlock all stake buildings), along with bishops, who get a key for their building.

MurdockM wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 6:19 pm When reading about the system I saw that there is a cost per user.

There is a license fee per user. That cost is managed by the FM group and they will allocate the appropriate number of licenses to be distributed across your stake.

What's going to be interesting is that there's likely a number of people who will loose access in the process. For example, perhaps the chapel clean up coordinator. In that case, the solution may be to require a someone from the ward council to attend each cleanup.

Does the Kindoo system itself require internet access? If so, I'd hope the STS gets a physical key to be able to fix a broken network.

Kindoo The system will either work on your Wi-Fi system or hardwire into your switch. There shouldn’t be any reason why your facilities people cannot have access. In our case each Ward was giving 30 licenses to use. I’m the manager for Stake in with that number, we still have plenty reserved. May want to just run a report showing your Collans with their email addresses. You can do an input via an XL file. Becomes very easy.

swigginton wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 7:41 pm Once things are stable with Kindoo, the locks get changed.

I'm the HCr assigned as the Stake SBR/PFR in our Stake and have managed our current eLock system for the past 1-1/2 years since it was installed.
For some Stakes like ours, where we were already converted to the Sicunet electronic lock system just a year and a half ago, having to transition to Kindoo now will be very challenging because our FM Manager has told us that they will take out the Sicunet system and replace it with the Kindoo system all in the same day. Converting an entire Stake of 400+ eLock users will be much more difficult than migrating from key locks to an eLock system.
We were told 10 days ago that we would be changed to Kindoo in a week, but we haven't been given any further updates since. I have asked for any type of training available so I can do some homework in advance, but nothing has been provided. I really wish there was better coordination and training available since the decision has been made to use the Kindoo system through out all Ward and Stake buildings.
To restate previous info provided of this thread, the pool of Kindoo licences provided to the Stake will cost $20 for each licence. A licence is required for each user configured in the system.

russellhltn wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 8:01 pm What's going to be interesting is that there's likely a number of people who will loose access in the process. For example, perhaps the chapel clean up coordinator. In that case, the solution may be to require a someone from the ward council to attend each cleanup.

Does the Kindoo system itself require internet access? If so, I'd hope the STS gets a physical key to be able to fix a broken network.

Yeah, the changeout has been interesting to see all the people who suddenly have a key that no longer works, and should not have had a key based on their current calling. It's cleaned up a lot of issues.
Kindoo itself doesn't talk to the internet. It's strictly a Bluetooth connection to the phone app. It's really a very simple device. The phone needs internet, since the core of the Kindoo system is cloud-based. That's where the authentication happens.

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 9:08 pm ... our FM Manager has told us that they will take out the Sicunet system and replace it with the Kindoo system all in the same day.

If there are unused wires in the Sicunet cabling, it may be possible to piggyback Kindoo on the system and run both at the same time for a transition period. I've done that in a few of our buldings, where we had that luxury. In most cases, the spare wires aren't there, so we had to do a direct cutover. When possible, we convert one building in the stake to Kindoo, and give all leaders access to that building so they can practice with it (assuming the stake isn't spread out for miles and miles). We have done some conversions where we had to cut over in the same day. We just trained the stake Kindoo managers, had them configure all users in the Kindoo system ahead of time and then did the cutover. It worked with no significant issues.

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Sep 27, 2024 9:08 pm I really wish there was better coordination and training available since the decision has been made to use the Kindoo system through out all Ward and Stake buildings.

I'm surprised your FM group isn't providing better coordination and training. I just trained another stake last night on Kindoo and they are diving in with no concerns at all. That training has been the magic formula to us receiving very few calls/questions/concerns about Kindoo. There are always initial fears, but once understood and implemented, it's been a very positive adoption. I'm honestly surprised that I don't get more calls/emails about it. It simply works.

Not sure if this was asked before or not. I have a member that is trying to get access to Kindoo on an iPhone. They are not able to log into their church account. They can use Chrome just fine on the same device to log into their church account, but Kindoo tries using Safari which does not work. Already asked them to restart their phone as well as update the OS. Wonder if there are other ideas.

mmacconnell wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2024 8:20 pm They can use Chrome just fine on the same device to log into their church account, but Kindoo tries using Safari which does not work. Already asked them to restart their phone as well as update the OS. Wonder if there are other ideas.

They probably need to set Chrome as the default browser in iOS. Kindoo is likely just calling up the default browser. The Church seems to be pushing things toward Chrome.

It would be interesting to see if most other iOS Kindoo users are able to use Safari , or if there's similar issues seen with others on iOS. I know I extremely dislike an app forcing me to change a default, regardless of how much easier it makes it for the app developers. Perhaps if there are other iOS users who successfully have Safari work with Kindoo, that might lead to other questions.

And yes, although I personally like Chrome, I do see a parallel in what the Church is trending towards with having Chrome be the preferred browser ...

mmacconnell wrote: Wed Oct 02, 2024 8:20 pm I have a member that is trying to get access to Kindoo on an iPhone. They are not able to log into their church account.

I wonder what the minimum iOS is. Kindoo shows it requires iOS 12.4 or later, but Member Tools requires iOS 16.0 or later. I'm not sure how the login to the church account works.

I'm wondering/curious if there are any tables in addition to smartphones that will work with the Kindoo app to open doors?

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Oct 06, 2024 3:03 pm I'm wondering/curious if there are any tables in addition to smartphones that will work with the Kindoo app to open doors?

I assume you mean tablets. I'm sure it does, but it has to have an internet connection to work. I'm not sure as you'd want to rely on being able to connect to Liahona outside the front door.

russellhltn wrote: Sun Oct 06, 2024 3:16 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Oct 06, 2024 3:03 pm I'm wondering/curious if there are any tables in addition to smartphones that will work with the Kindoo app to open doors?

I assume you mean tablets. I'm sure it does, but it has to have an internet connection to work. I'm not sure as you'd want to rely on being able to connect to Liahona outside the front door.

Yes Tablets, thanks for catching that typo.
The Kindoo website, and FAQs, does not mention the use of tablets, that is why I wanted to ask.
If the system does support tablets, it would be interesting to know what specific tablets are supported since only IOS and Android phones are supported. I would assume that the Amazon fire tablet would not.
Thanks.

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Oct 06, 2024 3:29 pm If the system does support tablets, it would be interesting to know what specific tablets are supported since only IOS and Android phones are supported. I would assume that the Amazon fire tablet would not.

I tested Kindoo on a tablet early in our installation process. It worked fine, but the tablet needs Bluetooth and an internet connection and needs to run the Android or iOS Kindoo app. I only tested on Android using the building's Liahona network. One important thing to note is the license can only be on one device at a time. If you log in on a different device, it will prompt to disable the license on the currently active device, so you can't have it active on a phone and tablet simultaneously.

swigginton wrote: Sun Oct 06, 2024 4:14 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Oct 06, 2024 3:29 pm If the system does support tablets, it would be interesting to know what specific tablets are supported since only IOS and Android phones are supported. I would assume that the Amazon fire tablet would not.

I tested Kindoo on a tablet early in our installation process. It worked fine, but the tablet needs Bluetooth and an internet connection and needs to run the Android or iOS Kindoo app. I only tested on Android using the building's Liahona network. One important thing to note is the license can only be on one device at a time. If you log in on a different device, it will prompt to disable the license on the currently active device, so you can't have it active on a phone and tablet simultaneously.

Thanks for that insight on using tablets.

I Sent an email to support@kindoo.tech asking about tablets and got a reply from a person at @locktronics.com who indicated that they are the provider of the Kindoo system for The Church.
This was the answer regarding tablets:
If the tablet has Bluetooth and is connected to the internet via Wi-Fi or cellular data, it will indeed be able to open the door.
I would also assume that the tablet would also have to be an android or IOS
They also said that they created a dedicated website for church members that provides answers to most common questions regarding Kindoo. mfd.locktronics.com
At the bottom of that web page there is a button for training. https://mfd.locktronics.com/training.html I found that these training web pages loaded very slow for me.
And then there is an option to click on for Application Training.
https://mfd.locktronics.com/ApplicationTraining.html

Once on the Application Training web page, there are these categories.

Kindoo User Guide for Site Administrators (Facilities Managers) Designed for: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
Administrators User Guide

Kindoo User Guide for Site Managers (Local Leaders) Designed for: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
Managers User Guide

Kindoo User Guide for Ward Members and Guests Designed for: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
Ward Members and Guests User Guide

Kindoo User Guide for Missionaries
User guide for missionaries

Kindoo Missionary Access Guidelines
Missionary access documentation

ELHawkes wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2024 8:42 pm I Sent an email to support@kindoo.tech asking about tablets and got a reply from a person at @locktronics.com who indicated that they are the provider of the Kindoo system for The Church.
This was the answer regarding tablets:
If the tablet has Bluetooth and is connected to the internet via Wi-Fi or cellular data, it will indeed be able to open the door.
I would also assume that the tablet would also have to be an android or IOS
They also said that they created a dedicated website for church members that provides answers to most common questions regarding Kindoo. mfd.locktronics.com
At the bottom of that web page there is a button for training. https://mfd.locktronics.com/training.html I found that these training web pages loaded very slow for me.
And then there is an option to click on for Application Training.
https://mfd.locktronics.com/ApplicationTraining.html

Once on the Application Training web page, there are these categories.

Kindoo User Guide for Site Administrators (Facilities Managers) Designed for: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
Administrators User Guide

Kindoo User Guide for Site Managers (Local Leaders) Designed for: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
Managers User Guide

Kindoo User Guide for Ward Members and Guests Designed for: The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
Ward Members and Guests User Guide

Kindoo User Guide for Missionaries
User guide for missionaries

Kindoo Missionary Access Guidelines
Missionary access documentation

In asking all of my questions about the Kindoo system, I keep getting told that the Kindoo system is easy and simple.
After looking through and reading these guides and after managing our current Sicunet eLock system that our Stake has had for the past 1-1/2 years, my concern is that the Kindoo system is being over sold. The Sicunet system is far less complicated and provides much more functionality.
We can add as many users to the system as needed without any licencing fees. Kindoo is $21 for each user licence
We can remote unlock any door on the system without having to install additional controllers at each door that remote access is wanted like the Kindoo system requires.
We have the option of using FOBs when needed. We have never had one break. when one is lost it is simply deactivated. FOBs are cheep. In my case I learned that I can get them for .25 cents each, a pack of 100 for 23-25$. I'll admit that my technical background allowed me to figure that out. But even if FOBs are $2.50 that is still quite inexpensive and they just don't get lost that often since very few members need them, about 95% of members use the Open Cesamee app for the Sicunet system in our Stake.
At any rate, the Kindoo system will probably replace our Sicunet system, but I just wanted to share my concerns.

Also, the Kindoo system is not bullet proof.
It is possible for anyone that has been given a Kindoo account, so that they can install the Kindoo app, to simply share their account info with someone else and transfer access between devices so they can open doors.
Granted, it is just like sharing physical keys, the key can only be used by one person or device at a time.
It's basically the same process as when a user gets a new phone or device, and the Kindoo account is used to activate the app on the new phone and deactivate it on the previous device.

ELHawkes wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2024 9:12 pm We have the option of using FOBs when needed. We have never had one break. when one is lost it is simply deactivated. FOBs are cheep. In my case I learned that I can get them for .25 cents each, a pack of 100 for 23-25$.

Sounds like yesterday's security. Which makes me suspect that it can easily be cloned by a Flipper Zero or other hacker devices.

ELHawkes wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2024 9:33 pm It is possible for anyone that has been given a Kindoo account, so that they can install the Kindoo app, to simply share their account info with someone else and transfer access between devices so they can open doors.

While that's certainly possible, I can tell you that Kindoo has an impressive activity logging system that would likely detect this and raise it as potential license abuse. It wouldn't surprise me if they already have code to deal with it. It's clear you have an affinity for the Sicunet system. I've worked with several different access systems and they all have their pros and cons. No different here with Kindoo. But, it's one of the most simple yet elegant systems I've used. I've been involved in installing, training and using it over the past 2 1/2 years, with amazingly very few issues. It's very secure and reliable. Their development team has been incredibly responsive to my suggestions and has even made changes to implement many of my requests (in coordination with the Church ICS folks). Clearly, the Church's FM and ICS teams are sold on it, as it's being implemented within LCR and being rolled out to all meetinghouses in US and Canada. Having been involved in early implementation in our FM group, I know adoption by the Church was not done lightly. Everything I've experienced with it shows it to be a very good solution.

russellhltn wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2024 9:45 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2024 9:12 pm We have the option of using FOBs when needed. We have never had one break. when one is lost it is simply deactivated. FOBs are cheep. In my case I learned that I can get them for .25 cents each, a pack of 100 for 23-25$.

Sounds like yesterday's security. Which makes me suspect that it can easily be cloned by a Flipper Zero or other hacker devices.

That's true with most FOB systems and another advantage of Kindoo. It sends a unique encrypted key every few seconds which is processed in the app and server to generate a unique encrypted unlock response. That response can only be used once, so trying to clone the Bluetooth protocol is futile.

Yes, FOBs can be cloned/duplicated just like physical keys can.
One thing to remember is that these electronic lock systems do not eliminate physical locks and keys to the ward and Stake buildings.
Each building still has a door designated as the emergency door that still has a physical key. Many people still have the key to that door, such as Bishopric keys, Stk Pres Keys, SBR/PFR keys, FM personnel keys, and the locksmith that keyed the buildings.
That emergency door lock can still be picked, it is a very standard type of lock. There are plenty of videos showing how to do it.
Those keys can still be lost, stolen, cloned, or duplicated.

It was stated that I have an affinity (a spontaneous or natural liking or sympathy for someone or something.) for the Sicunet system, that is simply not the case. This Form is intended to share concerns and that is my intent. On the other hand, those who are making money through the promotion/sales and installation of the Kindoo system would have an affinity for the Kindoo system.

As stated, (access systems all have their pros and cons.) None of them are 100% secure.
There are plenty of fancy and elegant words used to promote the Kindoo system, but when it comes right down to it, it's usually just about making money for someone.

If someone really wants to get into a church building, they will figure it out, even if it is just as simple as breaking the glass, or entering the building when it is open and hiding until everyone is gone.

Yes, valid points that I definitely agree with.

ELHawkes wrote: Tue Oct 08, 2024 5:55 am ...those who are making money through the promotion/sales and installation of the Kindoo system would have an affinity for the Kindoo system.

Just to clarify my role with Kindoo, I’m a retired software/business guy who volunteers time to help our local FM. I was asked to look at Kindoo for possible implementation in our FM group. I did that and we found it to be a much better solution than the various access systems previously installed in our meetinghouses. I did many of the Kindoo installations throughout our area and charged a very small amount to cover my costs. For me personally, there is no real financial benefit. I am certainly a fan of using Kindoo for our Church meetinghouses, but only because of the installation/configuration ease, reliability and responsiveness of the Kindoo folks. There are much better systems for other applications, but this one fits our needs very well. There was a fair amount of initial resistance, but we’ve since heard very positive comments from the 13 stakes, 2 mission offices, 2 FamilySearch centers, 3 institutes and the temple distribution center where we’ve installed it.

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Oct 06, 2024 3:29 pm If the system does support tablets, it would be interesting to know what specific tablets are supported since only IOS and Android phones are supported. I would assume that the Amazon fire tablet would not.

Amazon Fire tablets run Fire OS, which is a modified version of Android. It's likely that the Android app would work on a Fire tablet, but Kindoo would need to upload their app to the Amazon Appstore in addition to the Google Play Store (maybe they'd be willing to if there's demand, based on swigginton's experience working with them).

It's also possible to install Google Play Store on a Fire tablet and download almost any app, but the process of setting that up is a little hacky and probably not endorsed by Google or Amazon.

In our Area, they are not giving the Building Scheduler access to give rights to Kindoo. So it means that the Building Scheduler needs to coordinate with me anytime someone schedules the building. I have created a Google form that they can fill out to request this access. But just wonder if others have maybe come up with a better solution.

mmacconnell wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 10:36 am In our Area, they are not giving the Building Scheduler access to give rights to Kindoo. So it means that the Building Scheduler needs to coordinate with me anytime someone schedules the building. I have created a Google form that they can fill out to request this access. But just wonder if others have maybe come up with a better solution.

You might want to find out if the FM group or your stake president made that decision. If the FM group, your stake president can probably override that and tell the FM to add your building scheduler as a manager. It's important to understand that a Kindoo manager has the ability to manage any user in the stake, so you need to establish some parameters. In our case, our stake building scheduler understands that she only adds temporary users and is responsible to provide documentation and training to them, as needed. Everything else goes through our stake Kindoo manager (Stake STS). It may also depend on how frequently your buildings are used for private events. If very infrequent, your process is probably fine. If frequent, it makes sense to have someone dealing with those.

Great content on this thread. Thank you! Our stake is brand new to Kindoo. I have two questions:

1. Who is responsible for issuing Kindoo access to missionaries assigned to the areas in our stake? The stake? The mission?
2. Who determines the amount of licenses allotted to a stake? Can the stake increase it? We were given 25 per ward and 35 for the stake. I read earlier in this thread that other areas are getting 30 and 50 respectively. We're struggling to provide enough access.

Thank you!

J. Dunbar

jdunbar wrote: Sun Nov 24, 2024 1:00 pm 1. Who is responsible for issuing Kindoo access to missionaries assigned to the areas in our stake? The stake? The mission?

The stake does that. One license is assigned to each mission area in the stake. The stake issues access using the area email address, not the missionary's individual email address. That way, when transfers happen, the stake doesn't need to do anything. The new missionaries just log in using the area email address and take over that license.

jdunbar wrote: Sun Nov 24, 2024 1:00 pm2. Who determines the amount of licenses allotted to a stake? Can the stake increase it? We were given 25 per ward and 35 for the stake. I read earlier in this thread that other areas are getting 30 and 50 respectively. We're struggling to provide enough access.

Currently, the FM folks decide how many licenses to allocate. For our area, it's 50 per stake and 30 per ward. I've heard the Church will be recommending 25 per ward, but I'm guessing it won't be a hard limit, since there are reasonable exceptions. For example, we have a meetinghouse next to a temple in our area that gets scheduled for lots of one-time events, so they have some extra licenses to accommodate those additional temporary users. If you have a valid need, you can request additional licenses from your FM group. However, we've noticed that approximately 20% of the licenses issued to stakes are unused. The leaders receive access, but many don't need it and never use it. For example, a Primary counselor or EQ secretary may never need to unlock the building. You can see which licenses are unused and can pull those back to the stake an assign to others.

If you have issues a seat for a short time. You can Reuther lic again and again. As for the missionary,in our area all of the missionaries have the app there phones, the email goes to the e mail for the missionary in that unit

Kindoo was recently implemented in all buildings in our stake. My assignment is the stake Kindoo "Manager". Here are my suggestions for anyone assigned as initial Manager in the stake. Of course your Stake President and FM might have other guidance.

1) Send an early email advising stake / ward leaders about the change and the schedule.

2) FM will purchase licenses based on a certain number for the stake (X licenses) and a certain number for each ward (Y licenses). These licenses are all in the same shared "site" pool, but use those quantities as a rather hard limit for initial setup.

3) Instead of initially requesting a list of users for each unit, start with a basic list for the stake (the stake council) and for wards (the ward council). For now, leave off assistants, organization counselors and secretaries. Work with a stake clerk/executive secretary to generate one report for the stake and another for all wards using the LCR "Create a Report" to find members where "Calling Position Is" those members. Select these columns (in order) "Individual Email", "Unit", "Callings". For the Stake report, leave off "Unit". Select the text in the report "Preview" and paste it into a spreadsheet. Delete extra callings where users have more than one listed. Modify the spreadsheet to get 2 columns and output it as a CSV file:

Email@,Description
john_doe@gmail.com,Mountain Ward-Ward Clerk
mary_smith@yahoo.com,Valley Branch-Relief Society President
juan.jones@xyz.com,Stake-Stake Clerk

Kindoo assumes the first line is a header, so include that in each file. The file needs to be of type ".csv" for Kindoo to accept it.

4) Contact the Missionaries or mission office and get a list of "teaching area email addresses" and the associated unit in your stake. Format them in the same way:
123456789@missionary.org,Mountain Ward-Zion Mission
OR (if missionaries are going to be pulling from the stake license allocation)
987654321@missionary.org,Stake-Zion Mission

Add other initial users like early morning Seminary teachers etc.

Note: A consistent "Unit-Calling" description field is very helpful when managing licenses. In Kindoo after users verify their account, their name will be added automatically. You can export users as a CSV file and sort by description, or search in Kindoo for users based on unit, calling, name, or email.

5) Break the CSV files into a maximum of 50 users per file and make sure to add the header line in each file. You might want to break them up by building so that when you import each file you can give them access to doors in their building or access rules. Stake leaders might be given access to all doors in the stake. You can always change and edit access and user descriptions and add/remove users.

6) Import the CSV files into Kindoo. Then send an email to the list of email's from the spreadsheet, paste the list into an email (use BCC for privacy), and let everyone invited know they should have just received an invite from Kindoo. Attach the document or link to the "User Guide for Ward Members and Guests Designed for_ The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" (document found in link below) and have them contact you with any questions or problems. Let them know they will authenticate on their phone using their church login account.

7) Export the user list from Kindoo as a CSV file, sort it by description, and send a separate report to the Stake President and each Bishop showing the initial users assigned and inviting them to send you information to add/delete users within the allocated number for their unit. (Our stake is leaving decisions on who will get kindoo licenses to the Stake President and Bishop but within the number purchased by FM for each unit. Over time the Stake President can re-allocate or perhaps negotiate for a few more from FM.)

8) Continue to add/delete users as requested by the Bishop/Stake President and refer others requesting access to them.

A previous post provided a link to several manuals from Kindoo specifically written for the church. These will answer most questions. The manuals are available here (be patient - it's a slow site):
https://mfd.locktronics.com/ApplicationTraining.html

rknelson wrote: Thu Nov 28, 2024 12:19 am Kindoo was recently implemented in all buildings in our stake. My assignment is the stake Kindoo "Manager". Here are my suggestions for anyone assigned as initial Manager in the stake. Of course your Stake President and FM might have other guidance.

This is excellent, and is pretty much identical to how we train the Kindoo managers in our FM group. A couple of additional notes:

• You can use the Kindoo website (https://web.kindoo.tech/) to import and export the user lists. You may find that easier than using the app on a phone/tablet.
• When assigning access rights for users, always, ALWAYS use "Access Rules". Don't assign access by entry points. Following this will save you headaches later. Access rules can group multiple entry points into a single rule. If another entry point is added to a meetinghouse, you won't need to edit every user from that meetinghouse to add the new entry point. You just add it to the access rule for the meetinghouse. We also had to shut down a meetinghouse for a major issue. We simply changed the access rules for that meetinghouse to prevent members from entering, but had a separate rule for those who were permitted to enter during the work project. There is an option for Kindoo administrators to require managers to only assign by access rules. We enable that and pre-configure the access rules for each building.
• In the user description, we recommend using the ward abbreviation, rather than the full name, so it leaves space for the calling when displaying on a phone. Longer descriptions may get truncated.
• The Church is currenting creating official documentation for the upcoming LCR release that will include automatic Kindoo assignments based on callings. That will change this process and greatly reduce manager effort. My understanding (and hope) is they will let us link access rules to callings.

I have never heard of this app before I received an email this morning asking me to click on links in the email. In my previous employment, we were trained to never, ever, you will be terminated if you ever, click on links in unexpected emails.
We have ward conference this Sunday, I hope there is some training about this new technology.

jimhubbell wrote: Fri Mar 14, 2025 11:51 am I have never heard of this app before I received an email this morning asking me to click on links in the email.

I've never seen such an email but then I'm not a clerk so I may not have access. What do the full headers from the message indicate? From whom does it claim to be? What is it asking you to do?

In my previous employment, we were trained to never, ever, you will be terminated if you ever, click on links in unexpected emails.

I think such recommendations are overreactive and don't really serve to educate people about how to recognize good from bad. One might as well say "don't open any email at all". Sounds like a topic that Jame Mickens has probably addressed at some point in the last 20 years.

I think it's better to teach people to recognize truth from error and how to make intelligent decisions based upon the facts so they can recognize fraud on their own (or ask someone who is better at doing so).

ambldsorg wrote: Fri Mar 14, 2025 4:19 pm I think such recommendations are overreactive and don't really serve to educate people about how to recognize good from bad.

Scammers will often subsitute letters that are very hard to distinguish. An example I found:

A scammer might use "PayPaI.com" instead of "PayPal.com," where the uppercase "i" looks similar to a lowercase "L".

(In by browser the two look identical. I have to copy and paste it into something else to confirm that's what's going on.)

Add to that all the possible substitutions from extended character sets, and just education isn't enough. You can spot some fakes, but you can't be assured you'll spot all of them.

No doubt jimhubbell came here after receiving an odd email looking for some link between the church and Kindoo. There is one, but it wouldn't hurt to contact the alleged sender and make sure it's real.

russellhltn wrote: Fri Mar 14, 2025 7:42 pm No doubt jimhubbell came here after receiving an odd email looking for some link between the church and Kindoo. There is one, but it wouldn't hurt to contact the alleged sender and make sure it's real.

Indeed, that's why I proposed to entertain certain questions. I would first ascertain the origin of the email before acting upon it---the fact that there exists an association with The Church and Kindoo is just that, a fact, but it doesn't mean it's authenticated. The sense of urgency is what many scammers exploit.

Odds are that it's entirely legitimate, but it doesn't hurt to be skeptical and verify as much as possible.

jimhubbell wrote: Fri Mar 14, 2025 11:51 am I have never heard of this app before I received an email this morning asking me to click on links in the email. In my previous employment, we were trained to never, ever, you will be terminated if you ever, click on links in unexpected emails.
We have ward conference this Sunday, I hope there is some training about this new technology.

I would be suspicious as well if I didn't know Kindoo was being rolled out in my building. When we train on Kindoo in my FM group, we instruct the Kindoo managers to first send an email letting leaders know about Kindoo and include a user guide. The email also lets them know they will receive an invitation email from Kindoo to download the app and log in. Only after sending that advance-notice email do they add the users to Kindoo, which generates the automatic email invitation.

swigginton wrote: Mon Feb 27, 2023 9:43 am For our FM group, it's only external doors (1 to 3 doors, depending on the building configuration and whether there is a separate stake office entry). You still have physical keys for the material center, offices, outside gates, font, closets, shed, etc.

That's disappointing. It would be nice to have for Clerk's office and Material Centers as those tend to be restricted access yet keys are in the hands of a number of individuals.

russellhltn wrote: Mon May 05, 2025 8:04 pm

swigginton wrote: Mon Feb 27, 2023 9:43 am For our FM group, it's only external doors (1 to 3 doors, depending on the building configuration and whether there is a separate stake office entry). You still have physical keys for the material center, offices, outside gates, font, closets, shed, etc.

That's disappointing. It would be nice to have for Clerk's office and Material Centers as those tend to be restricted access yet keys are in the hands of a number of individuals.

There is technology coming from Kindoo to address the interior doors, but we'll need to see if the Church adopts it. It would solve a lot of issues.

Hello. I am looking for the approved callings list but am getting a message "The requested URL was not found on this server.", however just last week it was there on https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/too ... w?lang=eng. Does anyone know why that message is popping up on any of the links I click?

The Wiki is down right now, so those links are temporarily not working, sorry.

I just tried the link and it's working fine for me. It's not affected by the temporary wiki shutdown.

You might try using incognito mode just in case it's a problem with cookie build-up in the browser.

Thank you @russellhltn and @lajakckson. I have tried incognito, but I am still receiving the same message. I may need to try again tomorrow and hope it is fixed.

Ah, I see. The main page isn't on the wiki, but all the links do go to the wiki.

We don't have a timeline when it will come back up. The person responsible for it is on vacation, but is aware of the problem.

GMMHero wrote: Tue May 27, 2025 9:50 am Hello. I am looking for the approved callings list but am getting a message "The requested URL was not found on this server.", however just last week it was there on https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/too ... w?lang=eng. Does anyone know why that message is popping up on any of the links I click?

My question is the article implies that integration has been done now to automatically assign access based on callings. How does the transition work for those of us that have had to manually update access? When will they be transitioned, and will we get instructions and/or notification of this change?

Hello. I was planning to ask the same questions about how to automatically assign access based on callings, once I became a touch more familiar as I am still new. How does the transition work for those of us that have had to manually update access? When will they be transitioned, and will we get instructions and/or notification of this change?

I am hoping there is a way to give permanent names to some and then change users or like "floating access" that can be assigned to members on an as needed basis, such as organist needing to practice or activity day set up. I still need to also research more about the user types. In my mind ideally, some have permanent access and then units have a few "floaters" that are for others to use when needed.

The automatic calling synchronization is turned on individually by Stake by the Facilities Manager. Your stake will be notified by your Facilities Manager before this synchronization takes place. Functionality is being tested now for the FM to customize a list of 110 standard callings for a stake that will receive automatic building access. When a calling is enabled, it applies to all relevant units within the stake. For example, enabling “Relief Society President” will automatically assign licenses to everyone with that calling in all wards and branches. This is not customizable by ward. If multiple individuals hold the same calling in a unit, each will receive a license. Access is automatically assigned and revoked based on calling changes in LCR. All other callings must be managed manually in Kindoo by the Kindoo Manager.

For existing Kindoo sites, when the synchronization is initially turned on the system will check to see if individuals on the list already have access and update their records. Any current users that are not on the default calling list will still have access. So there is a risk that a stake may use up the remaining licenses if too many callings are selected.

If you have questions or want to help us test this functionality please reach out to your Facilities Manager.

waymana wrote: Thu Jul 10, 2025 10:11 am If multiple individuals hold the same calling in a unit, each will receive a license. Access is automatically assigned and revoked based on calling changes in LCR. So there is a risk that a stake may use up the remaining licenses if too many callings are selected.

I am in the process of requesting new electronic key fobs for our ward. I was told by our FM Facilities Coordinator/Admin Assistant that Kindoo is likely to be coming soon for our FM group. I was counseled to prepare our Ward Council that some leaders who currently have fobs could likely lose access in the future with more limited licenses and user seats. The FM admin didn't have more details at this time.

I did find the Kindoo pages on the Tech Wiki. I'm encouraged by the discussion of automatic calling synchronization. Some of my questions were addressed in the quote above. Namely, what is done when we have multiple members holding the same calling. Would only one of them get a license and the others have to coordinate with them? A lingering question is whether wards could use ward budget funds via transfer to obtain additional licenses or user seats? It feels like the standard callings that allow multiple individuals could quickly use up a quota of licenses. An unsuspecting or untrained clerk could cause trouble by adding callings in LCR. 20 licenses per ward go quickly - nearly half to a fully-staffed Bishopric leaves very few for organizations.

Some of the callings that currently have fobs in our ward that I can't find on the wiki list include youth advisers and materials center (library) specialists

greenwoodkl wrote: Fri Jul 11, 2025 12:35 am

waymana wrote: Thu Jul 10, 2025 10:11 am If multiple individuals hold the same calling in a unit, each will receive a license. Access is automatically assigned and revoked based on calling changes in LCR. So there is a risk that a stake may use up the remaining licenses if too many callings are selected.

I am in the process of requesting new electronic key fobs for our ward. I was told by our FM Facilities Coordinator/Admin Assistant that Kindoo is likely to be coming soon for our FM group. I was counseled to prepare our Ward Council that some leaders who currently have fobs could likely lose access in the future with more limited licenses and user seats. The FM admin didn't have more details at this time.
I did find the Kindoo pages on the Tech Wiki. I'm encouraged by the discussion of automatic calling synchronization. Some of my questions were addressed in the quote above. Namely, what is done when we have multiple members holding the same calling. Would only one of them get a license and the others have to coordinate with them? A lingering question is whether wards could use ward budget funds via transfer to obtain additional licenses or user seats? It feels like the standard callings that allow multiple individuals could quickly use up a quota of licenses. An unsuspecting or untrained clerk could cause trouble by adding callings in LCR. 20 licenses per ward go quickly - nearly half to a fully-staffed Bishopric leaves very few for organizations.

Some of the callings that currently have fobs in our ward that I can't find on the wiki list include youth advisers and materials center (library) specialists

Thank you for your questions.
Kindoo devices are being installed to improve the security of our buildings. Currently, with the fob system it is more difficult to track who has the fobs and they are easy to lose. With Kindoo you will be able to track who has access to the buildings and a stake Kindoo manager will be able to grant temporary access to individuals that are not part of the callings that are automatically synchronized from the available pool of licenses. The initial set of licenses allocated to a stake is meant to be a reset to the security of the buildings. Using the initial set of licenses for a few months and you can then review access logs and see who is or isn't accessing the buildings and request additional licenses. Just because someone currently has a fob doesn't mean that they need to have regular access going forward. Often if members only access the building on Sunday, after one person is in the building the exterior doors are unlocked. If someone only needs to open the building once every few months for an event or ward cleaning a stake Kindoo manager can grant them access temporarily when needed. The licenses are paid for out of the FM group budget and not from the ward budget. Once Kindoo licenses are purchased and associated with a stake, they are permanent and cannot be returned. As the licenses are permanent, we just want to be cautious of purchasing too many that won't be used.

If your stake received initially 170 licenses, you would want to make sure that the callings that needed access the most would be synchronized and that there are around 20 left over to grant temporary access as needed. This might mean initially that the Stake President decides to not include some callings that could have many people assigned such as technology specialists or assistant clerks and to have those individuals be granted access manually. All individuals that are in a calling that can be assigned to multiple people will receive access if that calling is enabled. Current functionality also is that the calling list is set at a stake level for all stake and ward callings by the FM in a Church system and is not customizable at a ward level. So it may be best to limit the amount of callings that are synchronized at first before adding additional.
Not all callings are available for synchronization right now. Other callings such as youth advisers and materials center (library) specialists maybe added in the future.

Let me know if you have additional questions. You can also see these two articles on the TechWiki that have more information and let us know if there is anything we can clarify.
https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions
https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... ndooAccess

One aspect I couldn't quite follow was the relationship between automatic calling access, and the percentage of buildings in a stake with Kindoo access. My assumption is that for many stakes, only one or two buildings have Kindoo access and the others remain normal key usage. But perhaps when a stake gets Kindoo access it's installed in every building throughout the stake (and if that's the case, I think the Wiki could benefit from including that clarification).

So under my assumption (which may not be correct) -- if for example a stake has 10 buildings and only one (the stake center used by only one ward) has Kindoo enabled, wouldn't granting automatic calling access to something like "Bishop" end up consuming 10 user seats for Bishops, and 9 of those user seats would be for Bishops that wouldn't ever use Kindoo in their buildings?

I'm just thinking that automatic calling access might lead to the overall pool of licenses, having a large portion taken up by members who will never use Kindoo because their buildings don't have it installed. But again, I may not have correctly understood how this is implemented, so hopefully somebody can set me straight.

Our Stake has it installed at every building. They started first by installing Kindoo but keeping the key access to allow leaders to get used to the system. The FM group just completed this week rekeying all the outside doors at the last two building, so no Kindoo is the only form of access to allow leaders of our buildings. There is one door with a key, but that is stored in a special box for the fire department to gain access.

mmacconnell wrote: Fri Jul 11, 2025 8:25 am Our Stake has it installed at every building. They started first by installing Kindoo but keeping the key access to allow leaders to get used to the system. The FM group just completed this week rekeying all the outside doors at the last two building, so no Kindoo is the only form of access to allow leaders of our buildings. There is one door with a key, but that is stored in a special box for the fire department to gain access.

Automatic calling access makes sense for situations like yours. I just wasn't sure if this was standard practice everywhere, or if there are stakes out there with partial Kindoo coverage, where they would want to take that into account when deciding what callings should have automatic access enabled.

I have been installing Kindoo and training stake leaders and Kindoo managers, so I’m very familiar with its functionality. The rollout has been extremely successful in the FM groups I’ve worked with. I’m wondering why the responsibility is placed on the FM managers to determine which callings get synchronized for a stake. It would seem more appropriate for the stake to make that determination, since they have greater visibility to the actual use of their buildings. Can you clarify why that was determined?
Also, is it possible to override the synchronization? For example, in most wards, an organization leader may need access, but in other wards, that same leader position may not. In those cases, the stake Kindoo manager would typically pull the unused license and allocate it elsewhere. This might also resolve the earlier question about Kindoo only being in some of the stake buildings.

Some comments and further questions:

It seems that Kindoo will rely on a proactive and responsive stake manager, or the experience could quickly degrade for the members. Especially if or when temporary access is relied upon more heavily than expanding licenses. Have stakes who already use the system tied the Kindoo manager assignment to particular callings, such as building scheduler, stake building rep, or high councilor?

It also seems that there is an assumption that building usage patterns are or should be driven primarily by calling responsibilities. I have a feeling individual agency coupled with delegation and unique cultures of wards and organization presidencies will introduce variability. I could imagine some members who prefer to do all their building specific work on Sunday (less need for Kindoo) and others who prefer to come in during the week. So the building access technology with associated costs could start driving behavior more than the flexibility and agency of today.

Does the automatic synchronization only apply to licenses? I hope the schedules can be applied differently to each user or ward? Thinking through situations such as how wards have different assigned weeknights for youth activities, or how Valiant Activity Leaders may have different meeting times for boys vs girls. We currently have Building Reps for cleaning that only need Saturday daytime and other building reps for security that need night access.

I will try to answer a few questions from previous threads. Please know that this functionality for automatic access synchronized with Church systems is currently being piloted and tested and so we are still working things out. Your comments are appreciated.

"Will ward callings (bishops) in buildings for the stake that do not have Kindoo installed take up a license?" No, the synchronization is turned on by the FM for each building and so a building that does not have the synchronization turned on would not take up those licenses.

"Why does the Facilities Manager have to specify which callings will receive automatic access? The system that integrates with Kindoo is only available to Facilities Managers. The FM will provide a spreadsheet to the stake president and stake kindoo manager and the stake will specify which callings should receive automatic access and then the FM will make those changes in the system.

Is it possible to override the synchronization? Yes, the synchronization can be turned on and off for a building. The Stake Kindoo manager can also override any assignment in Kindoo afterwards. So if you had one member that was part of a calling that you didn't want to have access you could remove them in Kindoo after the fact. The unused license goes back into the stake pool and can be reassigned to another calling.​ If the stake does not want to use the calling integration functionality all individuals will need to be given access manually.

Have stakes who already use the system tied the Kindoo manager assignment to particular callings, such as building scheduler, stake building rep, or high councilor? It is recommended that the Kindoo manager be either the Stake building rep or a stake clerk and is someone that is comfortable using the technology. It can be whomever the stake president decides. You can have more than one Kindoo manager in a stake but there should be one person that oversees everything. As access is managed at the stake level, it is recommended that there only a few managers per stake. In the past, all callings needed to be managed manually. With the ability to assign specific callings automatic access the Kindoo manager will only have to manage callings that are exceptions and then temporary guest access. If more managers are needed, one option would be to have the stake building rep and the building coordinators to have access and they coordinate how best to use the licenses. If you have too many managers it can get challenging to coordinate between them to make sure there are sufficient licenses. Again, stakes can request additional licenses from the FM group after testing the system for a few months and so if there is a need for additional licenses, they can be purchased.

Does the automatic synchronization only apply to licenses? I hope the schedules can be applied differently to each user or ward? The synchronization applies only to the licenses and they will be given default access rules. The Access Rules can be changed in Kindoo afterwards by the Stake Kindoo Manager.

greenwoodkl wrote: Fri Jul 11, 2025 9:09 am Does the automatic synchronization only apply to licenses? I hope the schedules can be applied differently to each user or ward? Thinking through situations such as how wards have different assigned weeknights for youth activities, or how Valiant Activity Leaders may have different meeting times for boys vs girls.

That's getting granular to a point where it's likely to be a hassle. While it may sound like a good idea, there's probably going to be too many exceptions and it becomes a headache to manage. Is there really a problem of people accessing the building "out of turn"?

waymana wrote: Fri Jul 11, 2025 7:23 am Not all callings are available for synchronization right now. Other callings such as youth advisers and materials center (library) specialists maybe added in the future.

I'm curious why all standard positions are not available.

greenwoodkl wrote: Fri Jul 11, 2025 9:09 am Does the automatic synchronization only apply to licenses? I hope the schedules can be applied differently to each user or ward? Thinking through situations such as how wards have different assigned weeknights for youth activities, or how Valiant Activity Leaders may have different meeting times for boys vs girls.

waymana wrote: Fri Jul 11, 2025 10:28 am Does the automatic synchronization only apply to licenses? I hope the schedules can be applied differently to each user or ward? The synchronization applies only to the licenses and they will be given default access rules. The Access Rules can be changed in Kindoo afterwards by the Stake Kindoo Manager.

russellhltn wrote: Fri Jul 11, 2025 11:18 am That's getting granular to a point where it's likely to be a hassle. While it may sound like a good idea, there's probably going to be too many exceptions and it becomes a headache to manage. Is there really a problem of people accessing the building "out of turn"?

I suppose it depends on how open or granular the "default access rules" are that are linked to the automatic sync. The example provided on this wiki page: Step 2: Define Access Rules provides a fairly granular access rule for Activity Days. If such a granular rule were applied across multiple wards in the same building that are assigned different days or times, that was the hypothetical concern I was contemplating.

• Redmond Activity Days Leaders
  • Users can enter the meetinghouse Tuesdays between 2:00 p.m. and 9:00 p.m.

From different meetings, the problem I hear about conventional keys:

• They're hard to track.
• Easy to duplicate.
• People hold on to them after release.
• They get stolen and then used in the dead of night for mischief.

Kindoo will solve the first three and most of the 4th, and a basic 6AM - 10:30PM schedule will solve the last.

Problems I'm NOT hearing is someone entered on their "off" day. I'd think that's more of a calendaring issue then a access issue. On a related note, I'm getting the feeling that most units have stopped using restrictions in the calendar to control activity days and just let everyone schedule. If some toes are stepped on, then an admin is notified and things are worked out.

The problem with granularity is now there's more work if something upsets the balance. Perhaps an activity day is rescheduled because of a holiday. If Kindoo is too granular, than an admin has to go in and adjust everything. If it's "all reasonable hours", then no problem. While it's nice to understand what the tool can do, it doesn't mean it's a good idea to implement it that way.

It would seem to me the technology behind Kindoo shouldn't have many or any technical limitations on the number of users who could access a building. The exterior door hardware should be a fixed cost. The smartphones and app installation are user provided. The variable cost appears to be in the purchased licenses. Are these software licenses significantly more expensive than the physical electronic key fobs?

waymana wrote: Fri Jul 11, 2025 7:23 am The initial set of licenses allocated to a stake is meant to be a reset to the security of the buildings. Using the initial set of licenses for a few months and you can then review access logs and see who is or isn't accessing the buildings and request additional licenses. Just because someone currently has a fob doesn't mean that they need to have regular access going forward. Often if members only access the building on Sunday, after one person is in the building the exterior doors are unlocked. If someone only needs to open the building once every few months for an event or ward cleaning a stake Kindoo manager can grant them access temporarily when needed. The licenses are paid for out of the FM group budget and not from the ward budget. Once Kindoo licenses are purchased and associated with a stake, they are permanent and cannot be returned. As the licenses are permanent, we just want to be cautious of purchasing too many that won't be used.

By my recollection the General Handbook is not specific as to when or which members should access the meetinghouse to fulfill their callings. What criteria should be used to determine if a member or standard calling should have regular access to the meetinghouse? It seems rather arbitrary. There seems to be an assumption on some level that most members or callings could fulfill their meetinghouse access needs on Sunday when the building is largely unlocked? Is there a goal or vision to lower meetinghouse use outside of Sunday meeting blocks? It could take some trial and error for a stake to cycle through different combinations of 20 callings per ward to find "who is or isn't accessing the buildings". I hope that the stakes who have current key fob logs available from their FM group use them to make an educational guess on their initial configuration.

My ward meets in our Stake Center with 4 wards plus the stake. There is not much time where the building is not in use on Sunday. For a hypothetical example, one of our organization leaders may have difficulty finding time on Sunday to organize their closet without disturbing another ward. They could choose to come during the week rather than disturb another ward. So in concept I could imagine that our building may find more weekday access use than a unit who is the only one assigned to their meetinghouse.

Other hypotheticals, I could see an attempt to minimize license assignment by only providing Kindoo access to organization presidents, but not their counselors or secretaries. Based on delegation or personalities, Ward 1 may find their RS 2nd Counselor lives closest to the building and becomes the point person who does the majority of non-Sunday access at the building. Ward 2 may find their RS 1st Counselor takes on the bulk of non-Sunday usage. If only the RS President callings in the building were assigned a license, these counselors would have to do extra work to get a license assignment change or obtain frequent "temporary access". Then a presidency gets replaced and the dynamics change again. Youth advisors and specialists may be more available to open the building for a weeknight youth activity before the Bishopric and YW Presidency. There are so many variables, it may be hard to standardize across a stake.

I could anticipate a member with a standard calling but without regular access becoming frustrated. They could find a friend or organization leader in the ward to meet them with their smartphone at the building. They could play a telephone, text, or email game trying to figure out what is Kindoo and who is the stake manager to get temporary access.

I don't envy the FM groups or stake Kindoo managers for the logistical and cultural impacts of this transition.

russellhltn wrote: Fri Jul 11, 2025 8:17 pm While it's nice to understand what the tool can do, it doesn't mean it's a good idea to implement it that way.

greenwoodkl wrote: Fri Jul 11, 2025 9:21 pm I don't envy the FM groups or stake Kindoo managers for the logistical and cultural impacts of this transition.

Our Brigham City Utah Stake transitioned from Physical Keys to the Sicunet - Open Cesamee electronic access system just over two years ago.
It supports both smart phones with the Open Cesamee app, and FOBs, and there are no additional fees for licences and the system can support up to 1500 users.
This system has worked very well and even though the smart phone app is the primary access, there are still around 7% of situations where the FOBs are needed.

Switching from Physical keys to an electronic system was fairly easy because both systems could be used while the transition was made. I can't imagine having to go from the Sicunet system to the Kindoo system overnight as both cannot co-exist.
I hope there is some consideration for keeping systems that are still new and that work well and still accomplish the same security upgrades over physical keys. I highly prefer to keep the Sicunet system after seeing all of the back and forth thoughts in this thread.
Is the millions that the Kindoo system will cost to roll out church wide along with all of the Incurred labor to manage it, out weigh what ever the current security problems are?

Over the past few years, the Church's technology teams have been evaluating several electronic building access solutions. While Sicunet has been installed in some locations, it does not meet the Church's standards for security and long-term direction for building access solutions and will be replaced. Kindoo is currently the only approved electronic building access in the United States and Canada.

We will update the tech wiki article that talks about access rules. Generally there should be two access rules for a building. One for leadership access that is set to always and then one for member access. There doesn't need to be an access for Activities Day leaders that is different than the regular member access. Temporary access can be more specific for a given day and time if someone needs access for an event. Many of these decisions are left up to the stake in consultation with the FM group.
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/too ... s?lang=eng

We are just starting to rollout the automatic calling synchronization functionality. Until this point all access was managed manually. We started with the callings that were the most common to receive access. Additional callings may be added. Temporary or other calling access can be added through Kindoo directly.

Additional licenses can be purchased by the FM group the stake after the initial few months of learning to use Kindoo. The main concern is that we don't over purchase licenses when individuals don't use them or could be given access temporarily instead. If the stake has concerns or special circumstances they should talk with their facilities manager.

We have recently updated the Stake Kindoo Manager Instructions. https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions.

Please reply here or send me a private message if you have comments or questions.

waymana wrote: Fri Aug 22, 2025 7:53 pm We have recently updated the Stake Kindoo Manager Instructions. https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions.

Please reply here or send me a private message if you have comments or questions.

A general comment: Online updates often can be confusing for those who aren't involved in a specific topic in an ongoing basis. For example, although I follow the Kindoo Forum discussions, I look at the updated instructions and have no idea what is new or changed, and I can't refer back to the previous version like I could if it was a printed copy. One thing I appreciate about the General Handbook and Gospel Library updates is that they are generally accompanied by some type of FAQ or overview, to help regular users be aware of where to look for differences.

So going forward, if you could additionally include some kind of note about the nature of the updates, that would be quite helpful. It wouldn't have to be an exhaustive description, but even just a high-level "release notes" statement about what was touched, would be good to have. That said, even just having updated instructions is a wonderful thing -- not every Church project has this, so your support is quite appreciated!

The wiki has a History tab for each article where you can see changes and compare versions.

greenwoodkl wrote: Mon Aug 25, 2025 12:58 pm The wiki has a History tab for each article where you can see changes and compare versions.

I probably saw posts previously about the Wiki History, and then forgot it! Thanks for pointing out what was already there, that's definitely helpful to know.

So I had all these nice access rules setup and everything was great. They then did the LCR integration and now people have 24/7 access and access to doors they should not. As the manager I am not allowed to revock the access as it was provided by admin.

So it basically sounds like all my access rules are garbage? I no longer have the ability to assign someone to rules and have it handle the access? We don’t want everyone having 24/7 access just because they are in a calling that automatically grants Kindoo access. So how do we do this?

mmacconnell wrote: Tue Sep 16, 2025 8:02 am now people have 24/7 access and access to doors they should not.

Is it the 24/7 access, or access to doors they shouldn't that's the problem?

I wouldn't expect 24/7 to be that much of a problem. From what I've heard, it seems that only external doors gets the system. For most buildings, an external door is an external door. What's going on in your situation?

We have some that access buildings late at night, specifically the YSA Gathering place. The Bishop over that building wants access only during specific hours for all but the Bishopric and Facilities group.

Just got a call from the group that is doing Kindoo. Apparently there is a switch they need to set so Managers have this this ability after the LCR integration. There is also something that Stake Centers get set so only Stake Leaders have access to the Stake Offices exterior door.

I will find out more after they get these settings done.

In post 21 viewtopic.php?t=41853&start=20#p249811 remote door access/unlock was briefly mentioned, but not clarified very well if Kindoo has the capability built in.
We will be having our Sicunet eLock system replaced with Kindoo in 2-3 weeks and that built in function of the Sicunet eLock system has been very handy to accommodate users for a number of reasons.
Does the Kindoo system include remote door access/unlock by the Stake Kindoo manager?

The ability to unlock a door remotely with Kindoo is not approved for security reasons. Kindoo has a controller device that allows someone to unlock the door remotely but it logs as the person that unlocked the door and not the actual person that entered the building. These are no longer being installed. Individuals should be granted temporary access instead.

waymana wrote: Sun Oct 19, 2025 9:48 pm The ability to unlock a door remotely with Kindoo is not approved for security reasons. Kindoo has a controller device that allows someone to unlock the door remotely but it logs as the person that unlocked the door and not the actual person that entered the building. These are no longer being installed. Individuals should be granted temporary access instead.

I was afraid that was going to be the answer.

It is really is pretty easy to create a temporary user even for a single use (I usually give them 24 hours). Of course the user does need to install the app and authenticate with their church account. From the moment I add them as a user (which can be done from my phone or a computer), it might take a few seconds for them to receive the email invitation, a minute or two to install the app and authenticate, and they are then able to unlock a door.

We have been told that there will initially be
50 licenses allocated to the Stake,
20 licenses allocated to each Ward,
we have not been able to get an answer if there are additional licenses allocated for branch leadership. We have two branches in our Stake.
Does anyone know if additional licenses are allocated for branches?
Thanks,
Larry

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Oct 30, 2025 8:41 am We have been told that there will initially be
50 licenses allocated to the Stake,
20 licenses allocated to each Ward,
we have not been able to get an answer if there are additional licenses allocated for branch leadership. We have two branches in our Stake.
Does anyone know if additional licenses are allocated for branches?

It is 20 licenses for each ward or branch. All the licenses are aggregated at the stake level for the buildings in the stake. A stake with 5 wards or branches would receive 150 licenses. So if a branch or ward doesn't need as many licenses, others in the stake could use them.

This thread has been wonderful. Thank you (especially to @swigginton for many initial detailed answers).

Perhaps it is because I know @greenwoodkl (we went to college together!) or maybe we just think alike, but I have some of the same thought processes and concerns.

Specifically, in my scenario, I'm in a supporting role to the bishopric, but not one of the callings that our stake will give access to. This is already causing some concern because as recently as 8 days ago I was asked to go over to the clerks office to help do an emergency fast offering check (it was a Saturday). In the future, I won't be able to do that. (Note that I want to be available on an emergency basis to do a check, but I do feel that by spreading the workload out I'm able to administer more so my ecclesiastical leaders can focus on ministering).

Unless: it appears that I can be persistent access for the duration of my calling, then that access can be removed when I'm released, right?

Note: this would not be a stake-wide thing since the stake probably doesn't want to automatically give finance clerks or assistant clerks access when they don't need it. But in my case, I'm the one that has been given primary responsibility for checks, but I'm going to be unable to help prep a check in the same way we've been doing it.

Another question: the stake mentioned that accompanists are going to be given default access (to practice the organ). But what if only one accompanist uses it? Will the stake be able to remove the default access for all accompanists and just let the one that uses it be given access? It feels like stakes have to tell the FM group which callings to auto-sync. Does this mean that to remove "accompanist" from auto-syncing the stake will have to tell the FM group, and then the FM group will update the configuration, and then the licenses will be freed up?

nathangg wrote: Sun Nov 02, 2025 9:38 pm Unless: it appears that I can be persistent access for the duration of my calling, then that access can be removed when I'm released, right?
----

Another question: the stake mentioned that accompanists are going to be given default access (to practice the organ). But what if only one accompanist uses it? Will the stake be able to remove the default access for all accompanists and just let the one that uses it be given access? It feels like stakes have to tell the FM group which callings to auto-sync. Does this mean that to remove "accompanist" from auto-syncing the stake will have to tell the FM group, and then the FM group will update the configuration, and then the licenses will be freed up?

Yes the calling list is customizable. The stake should let the FM group know which callings that they want synchronized with LCR for automatic access. They should have received a spreadsheet template to send to the FM group. The FM group can also provide a report based on the list provided of who will receive access once the synchronization is turned on.

Callings where not everyone in the calling needs access can be handled either by not synchronizing that calling and granting access manually or by synchronizing and then removing the people that don't need access. If you are having to remove people from Kindoo after they are added automatically it may be easier to not have that calling synchronized and the stake Kindoo manager can add those individuals as requested. So this would apply for both of your situations, you or the accompanists could request access for the duration of your calling and the stake Manager could keep track of those individuals separately. It maybe best to communicate the callings that are approved that can receive access upon request but will not receive automatic access.

nathangg wrote: Sun Nov 02, 2025 9:38 pm Another question: the stake mentioned that accompanists are going to be given default access (to practice the organ). But what if only one accompanist uses it? Will the stake be able to remove the default access for all accompanists and just let the one that uses it be given access? It feels like stakes have to tell the FM group which callings to auto-sync. Does this mean that to remove "accompanist" from auto-syncing the stake will have to tell the FM group, and then the FM group will update the configuration, and then the licenses will be freed up?

The interface software ("Sentry") add/removes users as changes are entered in LCR. FM is able to customize the list of callings that receive automatic access under the direction of each stake. It is not a ward specific list. When a person is added to a calling in LCR on the approved list they will receive access automatically and the person being released will have their access removed. Other individuals will need to be given access manually by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager. If someone in an approved calling does not need building access, they will need to be removed by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager in the Kindoo app after they have been assigned. The unused license goes back into the stake pool and can be reassigned to another calling. The software also integrates Church building data with Kindoo, so it will grant building access to the member’s home meetinghouse. There might also be some manual edits by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager for access to additional buildings. The user license is connected to the stake, so adding a building to a user does not affect the number of licenses.

Automation reduces the effort required by taking care of most but not all changes. I welcome the automation - it is quite a task to keep up with all the changes. In our stake we have a list of callings that are automated and a list of callings that need to be added manually as the Stake President or Bishop (or whoever they delegate) requests them. If you automate all the callings across every ward where they want that calling to have access you will run out of licenses, but many of them would never be used (for example the Organist needs to be able practice but is that person called as the Accompanist, Music Director, Music Leader, or Organist - we have some of each of these with current Kindoo access in our units). This does not to imply the non-automated callings are less in need of building access, just that they need some manual entry.

In my experience this system really does work well, and I only wish we could add Stake/Bishops/Clerks offices and the Library to Kindoo then we could dispense with a bunch of expensive ASSA keys. The cost would be for the Kin and door latch hardware, but it really would not require more licenses.

rknelson wrote: Sun Nov 02, 2025 10:34 pm
The interface software ("Sentry") add/removes users as changes are entered in LCR. FM is able to customize the list of callings that receive automatic access under the direction of each stake. It is not a ward specific list. When a person is added to a calling in LCR on the approved list they will receive access automatically and the person being released will have their access removed. Other individuals will need to be given access manually by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager. If someone in an approved calling does not need building access, they will need to be removed by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager in the Kindoo app after they have been assigned. The unused license goes back into the stake pool and can be reassigned to another calling. The software also integrates Church building data with Kindoo, so it will grant building access to the member’s home meetinghouse. There might also be some manual edits by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager for access to additional buildings. The user license is connected to the stake, so adding a building to a user does not affect the number of licenses.

Our FM has told us that they will be installing the Kindoo system in our Stake in the next week or two based on getting it scheduled with the installer. We have asked if we will get any prior access to the system so that we can learn and get familiar with managing the system, but from the response from the FM, access won't be granted until the day the system is installed. The FM asked us to chose which Stake and Ward callings to have Synced, which we did, but has never provided any type of spreadsheet.
The only advanced training provided is to simply read the instructions on this wiki website page, https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions
After reading all of the instructions, I was lead to believe that all of the callings that are Synced and get automatic access used up a licence whether the user used it or not. The information in the quote above that is bolded and underlined, is not explained in the online wiki instructions, so that is nice to know that a user can be removed even if they are in a calling that gets automatic access via a calling that is synced if they don't want or need access, so that licences can be reallocated and not wasted. Maybe someone can update the wiki to make that more clear.

ELHawkes wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 5:40 am

rknelson wrote: Sun Nov 02, 2025 10:34 pm
The interface software ("Sentry") add/removes users as changes are entered in LCR. FM is able to customize the list of callings that receive automatic access under the direction of each stake. It is not a ward specific list. When a person is added to a calling in LCR on the approved list they will receive access automatically and the person being released will have their access removed. Other individuals will need to be given access manually by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager. If someone in an approved calling does not need building access, they will need to be removed by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager in the Kindoo app after they have been assigned. The unused license goes back into the stake pool and can be reassigned to another calling. The software also integrates Church building data with Kindoo, so it will grant building access to the member’s home meetinghouse. There might also be some manual edits by the Stake Kindoo Key Manager for access to additional buildings. The user license is connected to the stake, so adding a building to a user does not affect the number of licenses.

After reading all of the instructions, I was lead to believe that all of the callings that are Synced and get automatic access used up a licence whether the user used it or not. The information in the quote above that is bolded and underlined, is not explained in the online wiki instructions, so that is nice to know that a user can be removed even if they are in a calling that gets automatic access via a calling that is synced if they don't want or need access, so that licences can be reallocated and not wasted. Maybe someone can update the wiki to make that more clear.

I agree with @ELHawkes (and I've bolded the sentence that stood out to me as important).

I'm at the ward level and am starting out with my access being revoked. The impression I got from the Stake Kindoo Key Manager was that there was nothing that could be done, however, upon reading this entire thread and the https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions instructions, it seems that my stake is still learning how all of this works (which is normal: we haven't implemented it yet so it is new to all of us).

I think for now I'm going to let things soak in, but I am working to provide accurate information back up to the Stake Kindoo Key Manager and my bishop so that the knowledge spreads around about how the system supports various needs (instead of being told "Only 14 people at the ward level get a persistent key and everyone else has to submit a google form for a one-time use key request" (they didn't send those words exactly, but that is the impression that is being conveyed)). It seems that after the initial rollout we can review with the Stake Kindoo Manager who in our ward is using the access and adjust things as needed.

I'm excited that the system is more flexible than I originally thought.

Thank you to everyone for helping increase understanding on how this works!

Kindoo is an approved app for our Missionaries and they have been using it for about a year now.

Our problem is the number of licenses. We only have 5 left which I keeping for temp users. Before the integration I could just ask the FM group for more. Now that we are integrated we have hit a wall getting more licenses. Plus we have a couple of people that are non-members that were approved to access our Family Search Center and no one is sure how we give them Kindoo access short of a temp license which is a pain to manage.

The thing I have found helpful is setting up Access Roles. I can give Bishoprics and the PFF’s 24/7 access but give others limited hours that would fit what their calling needs.

mmacconnell wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 11:06 am Plus we have a couple of people that are non-members that were approved to access our Family Search Center and no one is sure how we give them Kindoo access short of a temp license which is a pain to manage.

At one time the Operations Guide said non-members couldn't have keys to the FHS. Currently, all I can find in there is: "At least two staff members must be present when the center is open to the public and is the only activity going on in the building. If other activities or meetings are being conducted in the building, one staff member is sufficient."

General Handbook 35.5.3 says "Keys to the building should be given only to designated ward or stake members."

Trying to get keys to non-members is going to be an issue since things go back to the membership record - and they have none. There's nothing to tie their account to any area, much less a building. Given the policy, I don't know as there's going to be any fix forthcoming.

Thank you for your comments. The Stake Kindoo Manager Instructions have been updated with additional information about the calling synchronization. https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions. We have updated other materials for FMs but hadn't updated these materials.

waymana wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 7:40 pm Thank you for your comments. The Stake Kindoo Manager Instructions have been updated with additional information about the calling synchronization. https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions. We have updated other materials for FMs but hadn't updated these materials.

Thanks for the updates, this new sentence is very helpful. "The stake can also choose to synchronize access with a calling and then afterwards remove the access for a specific individual."

Our FM contacted us today and we will be getting Kindoo installed Wed this week.
He also provided a list of the callings we chose to sync with LCR, but there was not an option in Sentry to sync the "Stake Technology Specialist" but there was an option for "Stake building Specialist", a calling we didn't know existed.
I don't know if it is possible to get access to the management part of Kindoo prior to having it installed, but we have not received access yet. I find that very frustrating having to go into a new system mostly blind until it is installed and the entire stake loses their electronic access from our current Sicunet system all on the day they switch us to Kindoo. Hopefully that can be better coordinated with other Stakes and some type of training into managing the actual management interface, in the future.

mmacconnell wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 11:06 am ...Plus we have a couple of people that are non-members that were approved to access our Family Search Center and no one is sure how we give them Kindoo access short of a temp license which is a pain to manage.

It's possible to provide Kindoo access to non-members, but as @russellhltn mentioned, the handbook is clear about meetinghouse access for stake/ward members only. I gave access to a non-member door contractor so they could test Kindoo while adjusting a door. They need to create a church account. The Church website will ask if you are a member when creating your account. You can answer "No" and still proceed. You won't be linked to a ward/stake, but will have credentials to log in to the Church single sign-on when it appears in the Kindoo app. We've since enabled contractor access on all our Kindoo buildings, so this approach is no longer necessary for that specific use case.

mmacconnell wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 11:06 am ...a temp [Kindoo] license which is a pain to manage.

I'm not sure what would make a temp license a pain to manage. Temporary user access can extend all the way to the year 2099 in the menu, so they could last indefinitely. A temporary license has a starting date and time, and an ending date and time. It consumes a license the moment it is added (even if access isn't granted until a later date). Temporary users are automatically removed at the end date/time and that license then returns to the stake pool of licenses for reuse. It's helpful to give a temporary user a description like "North Pole 99th Ward - TEMP for Suzie Smith reception". That way a Kindoo Manager can easily see all temporary licenses by searching for TEMP.

Is there anyway to have the Resource Center door lock on this new system for access to be granted by calling as well?

As a ward council we have talked about this and would love to see it as an option. We would then know who is accessing the resources and more members (with callings) would have access to the Resource Center and not have to wait for Sunday access only.

I also would like to note my disappointment in the fact that we are going away from FOBs. I use FOBs for my Gym and Community Theater access and they all can be programmed to the same FOB for ease of use. But I don't want to have to use an app for this system only - it feels like we are going backwards in the use and implementation of technology. I am sure for those who didn't adopt the FOBs well they probably won't know the difference but for us we will have extreme challenges going forward. And we do have many who don't have smart phones.

Known Smartphone issues

Are there any known issues installing and using the Kindoo app on any particular types-brands-age of smartphones?

What is done to resolve any of the known issues?

ELHawkes wrote: Tue Nov 04, 2025 5:55 am Known Smartphone issues

Are there any known issues installing and using the Kindoo app on any particular types-brands-age of smartphones?

What is done to resolve any of the known issues?

We have not had any real issues, on our end. The most common thing is they need to have either their cellular data or a WiFi connection to use it.

Also they need to remember to use the email address showing in Member Tools or LCR for them. I would get some that complained they were being asked to supply a contractor PIN when trying to open the door. Turns out they were signing into Kindoo using a different email address. When they use the one associated with their Church account it will use the Churches SSO to have you sign into Kindoo and that would resolve the contractor pin issue.

martelldansie wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 11:25 pm I also would like to note my disappointment in the fact that we are going away from FOBs. I use FOBs for my Gym and Community Theater access and they all can be programmed to the same FOB for ease of use. But I don't want to have to use an app for this system only - it feels like we are going backwards in the use and implementation of technology. I am sure for those who didn't adopt the FOBs well they probably won't know the difference but for us we will have extreme challenges going forward. And we do have many who don't have smart phones.

FOBs have many of the same problems as keys. They have to be tracked. They can also be swiped or loaned out inappropriately. During one of the safety briefings we've had, we were told about the wayward child of a released church leader who got their hands on dad's keys and trashed the meetinghouse. Dad still had the keys because no one wanted to take the keys back from the released leader. With the Kindoo system, the son would have to take the phone. And once released, a leader's access is revoked automatically. Given the ongoing cost of Kindoo, I'm sure the leaders weighed the options, but valued the security and linking to one's calling other more common methods.

It may be a step back in user convivence, but a step up in security.

martelldansie wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 11:25 pm Is there anyway to have the Resource Center door lock on this new system for access to be granted by calling as well?

As a ward council we have talked about this and would love to see it as an option. We would then know who is accessing the resources and more members (with callings) would have access to the Resource Center and not have to wait for Sunday access only.

It's not possible at this time. I know there has been discussion in this thread (and others) about interior door access via Kindoo. I think even more important than the Resource Center, is considering how many stray keys there are in existence for any particular clerk's office door! And I'm sure there's plenty of Bishop's office doors that also have lots of unknown keys in unknown places. Kindoo on those doors would definitely provide better security for those areas.

My understanding is that those in charge know that this would be a useful feature, but that given the current economics (and other factors), it seems unlikely to be anything that is offered in the near future.

Question regarding manual removal of members in synced callings, when they are eventually released. As an example, let's say the stake decides all Organists should be automatically synced (I'm not saying it makes sense, just using it for example). And then 6 of the 10 organists in the stake say they don't need access, and so their 6 user licenses are then returned to the general pool. When one of those organists is eventually released and a new one is called, I believe the automatic process will then assign that organist as a Kindoo user, correct? And of course that new organist may or may not want to retain building access.

I think my point is that if a stake is "aggressively" using the sync-and-manually-remove process to both automate things, as well as to try and minimize unused licenses, they need to also be aware that the licenses they manually free up may not always be that way. In my example, if the stake in question was consistently hitting their overall user limit and doing their best to try and spread the licenses around, if all 6 organists without Kindoo access are released, and the new 6 organists all desire Kindoo access, that would throw a wrench into their scheme. Obviously not all six would be released at the same time so the stake would have time to individually react and adjust.

I'm just trying to map out the long-term implications of sync-and-manual-removal, and account for that in the initial planning stages so if a stake is doing a lot of that, they understand they may have to rebalance things as members are released and new ones called.

ELHawkes wrote: Tue Nov 04, 2025 10:51 am How about email systems, are there any email systems that typically block the Kindoo invites?
What Solutions are there in the event that is a problem?

When the Kindoo Manager adds a user an invite is sent. If it is blocked, you can resend the invite and copy yourself on the invite, then forward the invite to the user yourself. This gets around the blocking and spam folder issue. I always send a short email to the users I add (with them all on "BCC") stating: "You should have just received an invitation to install the Kindoo app on your phone. Please follow the instructions in that email and authenticate with your church account login and password. The app uses bluetooth so you need to be near the door to actually open it. You have access to the Stake Center from 5 am to 11 pm, 7 days a week. Phone me if you have any problems."

This lets users understand they are not giving their church account login information to something nefarious.

BrianEdwards wrote: Tue Nov 04, 2025 11:41 am ...my point is that if a stake is "aggressively" using the sync-and-manually-remove process to both automate things, as well as to try and minimize unused licenses, they need to also be aware that the licenses they manually free up may not always be that way.

I view the automatic sync as a way to deal with the 80% of callings that obviously need access and where there aren't multiple people with the same calling in a unit. We don't automatically add assistants, organization secretaries and many other callings - there are certainly cases where they need access, but manually adding them makes more sense. FYI, we've been on Kindoo for a year now. Just over 13% of current invitees have never accepted their invitation (most of them are a year old invite and re-invites were sent several times) and I haven't trimmed them out in bulk because we have enough licenses. We can trim those back when needed and we could go further (more work by parsing the logfiles) to reclaim licenses from users that never (or very rarely) use them. I send the ward Executive Secretary and Clerk with CC to Bishop a list of current users periodically which also includes if the invitation was accepted. They trim out unaccepted invites sometimes. They know the number of licenses allocated to their unit and I always tell them we have a few extra licenses if needed. In my experience the overreaction on the number of users (which I also had initially!) calms down and really isn't an issue over time. If after a few months you feel there is an issue (we haven't) work with the Stake President to request FM to add more licenses.

What happens in regard to licenses when a member has two callings that are Auto synchronized? For example what if the callings of high counselor and Stake Building rep are both synchronized and the same person has both callings.

ELHawkes wrote: Tue Nov 04, 2025 1:20 pm What happens in regard to licenses when a member has two callings that are Auto synchronized?

Kindoo only issues one license for each unique email address. Trying to add a second user to an existing email generates a "Duplicate Entry" error. High Councilors often have double callings like Stake Young Men President, Stake Sunday School President, and Stake Building Representative.

russellhltn wrote: Tue Nov 04, 2025 10:33 am

martelldansie wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 11:25 pm I also would like to note my disappointment in the fact that we are going away from FOBs.

FOBs have many of the same problems as keys. They have to be tracked. They can also be swiped or loaned out inappropriately. During one of the safety briefings we've had, we were told about the wayward child of a released church leader who got their hands on dad's keys and trashed the meetinghouse. Dad still had the keys because no one wanted to take the keys back from the released leader. With the Kindoo system, the son would have to take the phone. And once released, a leader's access is revoked automatically. Given the ongoing cost of Kindoo, I'm sure the leaders weighed the options, but valued the security and linking to one's calling other more common methods.

It may be a step back in user convivence, but a step up in security.

FOBs that rely on simple RFID or NFC can also be easily duplicated/cloned to other devices. The Kindoo app connects to the internet to authenticate with a rotating code that changes frequently, making it much harder to clone (if I'm understanding the technology correctly). Having access tied to Church Accounts also provides a clear audit trail, if there's a need to see who accessed the building at a given time or day.

BrianEdwards wrote: Tue Nov 04, 2025 11:41 am Question regarding manual removal of members in synced callings, when they are eventually released. As an example, let's say the stake decides all Organists should be automatically synced (I'm not saying it makes sense, just using it for example). And then 6 of the 10 organists in the stake say they don't need access, and so their 6 user licenses are then returned to the general pool. When one of those organists is eventually released and a new one is called, I believe the automatic process will then assign that organist as a Kindoo user, correct? And of course that new organist may or may not want to retain building access.

I think it is more difficult to remove access from some members vs assigning them manually upon request. It is also less confusing for members who would receive an email from Kindoo and then not have access. I would recommend that the Stake President identify callings that can receive Kindoo access if requested and it is communicated out to the Bishoprics. Organists have a legitimate need to have building access so that they can practice the organ as they likely don't have one at their home. However, if an organist/accompanist doesn't need access then that frees up a license.

Interesting, I've never seen a Kindoo system. I wonder if my stake will be implementing that technology anytime in the near future?

I'm surprised by the key licensing limitations. I would think the church would prefer to negotiate an unlimited key license for all units to use? Or, if Kindoo doesn't provide a cost effective way to do that, the Church could just build their own access control system. I've done that before and it's pretty easy. The door actuators/strike plates and UPS (one per site) are the biggest expense -- but Kindoo likely has those same requirements.

My biggest worry with using my phone as the key to my home/garage is I have tendency to drain my phone battery nearly dead at the end of the day
I'd have the same worry with an electronic [phone based] church key or having my temple recommend solely on my phone.

For all those with (understandable) concerns about the Kindoo system, I'd also add that it is currently being successfully used in very high-traffic situations that I'm aware of. One building is the Kirtland Stake Center, which from my limited experience seems to be constantly in use (especially over the spring/summer/fall) by large groups that are visiting Kirtland, in addition to the normal local usage. Another is the stake center which sits on the same lot as our local Temple, and the stake center gets a similar traffic pattern of out-of-stake groups that desire to use the building as a gathering place for different activities (many members travel multiple hours to get to our Temple, so it can be an all-day affair). I know this stake center has many additional building needs like Pathways groups, YSA gatherings, ARP meetings, etc, that they also balance. These two buildings have had Kindoo for a few years now, and I've used the Kindoo app a couple of different times for each of those buildings, and from my end-user perspective things worked nicely.

Interestingly, the first time I was a bit perplexed as to why the Kindoo admin didn't want to give me access until two days before our event. I kept getting worried that our group would be forgotten, so I ended up bothering the admin multiple times that week with the same request (please don't forget us). Now I understand it was due to the fact that once a reservation is made in the system, I would take up a license until our event finished, and they probably had mid-week people who also needed temp licenses. Perhaps this was communicated to me somewhere in the various emails, but I may have missed it. I can't speak as to how easy it is for the Kindoo admins for each of these buildings to manage things, but I'm guessing it's a constant churn, and they may have an additional resource/manager to help spread the load.

russellhltn wrote: Tue Nov 04, 2025 10:33 am

martelldansie wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 11:25 pm I also would like to note my disappointment in the fact that we are going away from FOBs. I use FOBs for my Gym and Community Theater access and they all can be programmed to the same FOB for ease of use. But I don't want to have to use an app for this system only - it feels like we are going backwards in the use and implementation of technology. I am sure for those who didn't adopt the FOBs well they probably won't know the difference but for us we will have extreme challenges going forward. And we do have many who don't have smart phones.

FOBs have many of the same problems as keys. They have to be tracked. They can also be swiped or loaned out inappropriately. During one of the safety briefings we've had, we were told about the wayward child of a released church leader who got their hands on dad's keys and trashed the meetinghouse. Dad still had the keys because no one wanted to take the keys back from the released leader. With the Kindoo system, the son would have to take the phone. And once released, a leader's access is revoked automatically. Given the ongoing cost of Kindoo, I'm sure the leaders weighed the options, but valued the security and linking to one's calling other more common methods.

It may be a step back in user convivence, but a step up in security.

This logic doesn't make sense to me. FOBs can be turned on and off remotely when callings change. Yes they can be shared with counselors and others needing access for a one time event but now you will inconvenience all leaders in requiring that they go for those one-time events.

martelldansie wrote: Wed Nov 05, 2025 8:27 pm FOBs can be turned on and off remotely when callings change.

FOBs can be turned off - but will they? How hard would it be to link it to callings? Kindoo seems to offer an API to do it.

martelldansie wrote: Wed Nov 05, 2025 8:27 pm Yes they can be shared with counselors and others needing access for a one time event but now you will inconvenience all leaders in requiring that they go for those one-time events.

First, there's no need to arrange to meet for a hand-off for keys or fobs (and trying to get them back). From what I'm reading here, there's ways of assigning a license for a one-time event. When done, you get that license back. No run-around trying to make it happen.

mdigi wrote: Wed Nov 05, 2025 2:32 am I'm surprised by the key licensing limitations. I would think the church would prefer to negotiate an unlimited key license for all units to use?

If there's no pressure to limit the number of licenses, then why not just give everyone access? Far less work to manage that way.

I think there's wisdom of keeping wards/stakes just a little "hungry" so they manage their license to those who who have an actual need for it.

martelldansie wrote: Wed Nov 05, 2025 8:27 pm ...FOBs can be turned on and off remotely when callings change. Yes they can be shared with counselors and others needing access for a one time event but now you will inconvenience all leaders in requiring that they go for those one-time events.

Most Fob's and keycards can be duplicated on a small device you can buy that includes 5 fobs and 5 keycards and costs under $10. It only takes a minute to copy one. Some are a little more secure where you need a specific frequency or a specific brand of fob/card, I don't think they are near as secure as Kindoo.

russellhltn wrote: Wed Nov 05, 2025 8:52 pm First, there's no need to arrange to meet for a hand-off for keys or fobs (and trying to get them back). From what I'm reading here, there's ways of assigning a license for a one-time event. When done, you get that license back. No run-around trying to make it happen.

Those are significant benefits of Kindoo vs. fobs/hard keys. Kindoo resources are virtual, rather than physical. You can grant access to someone immediately, with no need to transfer a physical device. You can schedule access expiration, with no need to recover the fob/key. Yes, upon expiration of a temporary license, it's returned to the pool for immediate use elsewhere.

We got the Kindoo system installed yesterday to replace Our Sicunet system, and all of the user callings that were synchronized from LCR have somewhat random descriptions.
Is it possible to do a bulk add to change descriptions the same way it is done for "Bulk Adding or Changing Access Rights"   as described on the manager web page?
https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... rs_in_Bulk

ELHawkes wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 8:17 pm

waymana wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 7:40 pm Thank you for your comments. The Stake Kindoo Manager Instructions have been updated with additional information about the calling synchronization. https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions. We have updated other materials for FMs but hadn't updated these materials.

Thanks for the updates, this new sentence is very helpful. "The stake can also choose to synchronize access with a calling and then afterwards remove the access for a specific individual."

Our FM contacted us today and we will be getting Kindoo installed Wed this week.
He also provided a list of the callings we chose to sync with LCR, but there was not an option in Sentry to sync the "Stake Technology Specialist" but there was an option for "Stake building Specialist", a calling we didn't know existed.
I don't know if it is possible to get access to the management part of Kindoo prior to having it installed, but we have not received access yet. I find that very frustrating having to go into a new system mostly blind until it is installed and the entire stake loses their electronic access from our current Sicunet system all on the day they switch us to Kindoo. Hopefully that can be better coordinated with other Stakes and some type of training into managing the actual management interface, in the future.

We just got Kindoo yesterday and I found that this does not work.
This is the sentence in the instructions.
The stake can also choose to synchronize access with a calling and then afterwards remove the access for a specific individual.
This is the message when I get when trying to delete a user that was added via Sync from LCR.
User invited by administrator, please contact your site administrator to revoke/edit the user.

https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... d_Callings

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Nov 06, 2025 9:17 pm User invited by administrator, please contact your site administrator to revoke/edit the user.

The FM will have to enable a setting in the Kindoo site to allow for managers to change the access for those that were granted access by the LCR integration (Sentry) or by an Admin.

On your other question of updating the descriptions. I would advise against changing the descriptions as it makes more work for you. When callings change you will have to update those. What is confusing about the description that is generated from LCR?

waymana wrote: Thu Nov 06, 2025 9:34 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Nov 06, 2025 9:17 pm User invited by administrator, please contact your site administrator to revoke/edit the user.

The FM will have to enable a setting in the Kindoo site to allow for managers to change the access for those that were granted access by the LCR integration (Sentry) or by an Admin.

On your other question of updating the descriptions. I would advise against changing the descriptions as it makes more work for you. When callings change you will have to update those. What is confusing about the description that is generated from LCR?

Because having the name of the City, and for Stake callings, the name of the city and the State at the beginning of every description that is synced, makes it much more difficult to sort on the Ward name when exporting the user list to a csv file and into a spread sheet to be able to see each ward as a group. Maybe there are other techniques to learn, but I've only had management access to this system for one day now.

What is the setting called that needs to be turned on so that I can delete users that were added via sync, so I can tell my FM what to look for?
Thanks for your assistance, it's much appreciated.

Another question, why is the system setup so that we have to go through the FM to turn on or off which callings get synced? It would be much more convenient for the Stake managers to be able to do that directly. We really don't have any way to verify which callings are synced other than to ask the FM.
I found tonight that the ward music coordinators were auto synced rather than the Stake music coordinators that we had pre-selected in our list given to the FM. Having to go through the FM to clean that up makes for a much more lengthy process.
If there is a way to change and let the Stake managers have access to turn on or off which callings are synced, that would be much nicer and convenient.
Thanks again for the assistance and consideration.

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Nov 06, 2025 10:28 pm Another question, why is the system setup so that we have to go through the FM to turn on or off which callings get synced? It would be much more convenient for the Stake managers to be able to do that directly. We really don't have any way to verify which callings are synced other than to ask the FM.
I found tonight that the ward music coordinators were auto synced rather than the Stake music coordinators that we had pre-selected in our list given to the FM. Having to go through the FM to clean that up makes for a much more lengthy process.
If there is a way to change and let the Stake managers have access to turn on or off which callings are synced, that would be much nicer and convenient.

Currently the system that is used to synchronize the callings is only available to FMs as that is their tool to also administer Kindoo, setup sites, and purchase licenses. In the future, we are hoping that the stake and wards will have greater control over which callings are synchronized.

Turning off Auto Sync between Kndoo and LCR
If we were to choose to have auto sync turned off for any or all callings that are currently enabled, would turning off the auto sync between Kindoo and LCR automatically delete those callings/users out of Kindoo, or would they remain in Kindoo for manual management?

waymana wrote: Thu Nov 06, 2025 10:39 pm Currently the system that is used to synchronize the callings is only available to FMs as that is their tool to also administer Kindoo, setup sites, and purchase licenses.

This makes sense when we remember that Wards and Stakes don't "own" the buildings. Wards and Stakes are tenants in buildings they are assigned to meet in. I have seen many cases were units were moved to another building for their meetings (for various reasons - sometimes temporary and sometimes permanent).

davesudweeks wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 11:38 amThis makes sense when we remember that Wards and Stakes don't "own" the buildings. Wards and Stakes are tenants in buildings they are assigned to meet in.

This also aligns with my experience when requesting physical keys. YMMV (since not all Stakes and FM Groups are created alike), but the times that I was personally involved in requesting new keys, we went through the Stake HC who then sent the request on to the FM Group. And each time, there was "pushback" about the request. Objectively, I completely understand, since our answers of "well, even though last year we had enough keys, now we need 10 more because we don't know where 10 of our keys went", wasn't really satisfactory Just to say that my understanding is that the FM Group is technically the ones who provide the physical keys, not the stake. And their reluctance to automatically provide new keys has less to do with the economics (although certainly a factor), and more to do with their stewardship for maintaining building access and security.

It's hard to assess from the outside now, but I'd expect that the effort involved in getting things setup and maintained inside Kindoo, may be essentially the same as the combined effort required to manually create and maintain a master key list in each individual unit throughout a stake. And since some/many/most units do a lousy job of tracking all kinds of physical keys (anyone else have a couple of bags full of random keys in their clerk's office??), having this constrained system hopefully enforces better management of building outer access. Yes each unit will still track inside keys, but hopefully that's much easier once the outer access is solely via Kindoo, and tightly connected to current member callings.

davesudweeks wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 11:38 am

waymana wrote: Thu Nov 06, 2025 10:39 pm Currently the system that is used to synchronize the callings is only available to FMs as that is their tool to also administer Kindoo, setup sites, and purchase licenses.

This makes sense when we remember that Wards and Stakes don't "own" the buildings. Wards and Stakes are tenants in buildings they are assigned to meet in. I have seen many cases were units were moved to another building for their meetings (for various reasons - sometimes temporary and sometimes permanent).

The units don't own the buildings, but if the cost/pain/friction of meetinghouse usage grows enough, members as tenants may stop using the same buildings that were built to support their activities. A new take on home-centered, church-supported by making the meetinghouses less usable and accessible. From an "outside" perspective not privy to the project and security discussions, it seems the largest fixed cost is the hardware installation at the doors. The members shoulder the cost of owning and maintaining an app-compatible smartphone. The variable cost seems to be whatever price per license was arranged between the Church and the vendor. That variable cost should in theory be set sufficiently to cover the cost to maintain the software, the network, handling the communication between the phone apps and the door, plus whatever markup for the vendor to be profitable. It would seem to be a negligible difference for the technology to support 20 or 400 or more authorized users at a building even as we wrestle over the arbitrary license limits established.

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 10:29 am If we were to choose to have auto sync turned off for any or all callings that are currently enabled, would turning off the auto sync between Kindoo and LCR automatically delete those callings/users out of Kindoo, or would they remain in Kindoo for manual management?

Existing users would stay. Sentry software license add/deletes are triggered by a change of calling in LCR.

davesudweeks wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 11:38 am

waymana wrote: Thu Nov 06, 2025 10:39 pm Currently the system that is used to synchronize the callings is only available to FMs as that is their tool to also administer Kindoo, setup sites, and purchase licenses.

This makes sense when we remember that Wards and Stakes don't "own" the buildings. Wards and Stakes are tenants in buildings they are assigned to meet in. I have seen many cases were units were moved to another building for their meetings (for various reasons - sometimes temporary and sometimes permanent).

While Wards/Stake don't own the buildings, stake presidencies have the ecclesiastical authority to determine who gets access to their buildings. The FM organization facilitates that access through hard keys, electronic access systems, etc. That's why Sentry should be the resource for the overall configuration of Kindoo by the FM group, but LCR should be the resource to configure who has access and should be managed at the stake level.

rknelson wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 1:06 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 10:29 am If we were to choose to have auto sync turned off for any or all callings that are currently enabled, would turning off the auto sync between Kindoo and LCR automatically delete those callings/users out of Kindoo, or would they remain in Kindoo for manual management?

Existing users would stay. Sentry software license add/deletes are triggered by a change of calling in LCR.

Thank you, that is good to know.
Maybe that can also be added to the wiki instructions for a little more clarification.

greenwoodkl wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 12:49 pm

davesudweeks wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 11:38 am

waymana wrote: Thu Nov 06, 2025 10:39 pm Currently the system that is used to synchronize the callings is only available to FMs as that is their tool to also administer Kindoo, setup sites, and purchase licenses.

This makes sense when we remember that Wards and Stakes don't "own" the buildings. Wards and Stakes are tenants in buildings they are assigned to meet in. I have seen many cases were units were moved to another building for their meetings (for various reasons - sometimes temporary and sometimes permanent).

The units don't own the buildings, but if the cost/pain/friction of meetinghouse usage grows enough, members as tenants may stop using the same buildings that were built to support their activities. A new take on home-centered, church-supported by making the meetinghouses less usable and accessible. From an "outside" perspective not privy to the project and security discussions, it seems the largest fixed cost is the hardware installation at the doors. The members shoulder the cost of owning and maintaining an app-compatible smartphone. The variable cost seems to be whatever price per license was arranged between the Church and the vendor. That variable cost should in theory be set sufficiently to cover the cost to maintain the software, the network, handling the communication between the phone apps and the door, plus whatever markup for the vendor to be profitable. It would seem to be a negligible difference for the technology to support 20 or 400 or more authorized users at a building even as we wrestle over the arbitrary license limits established.

BrianEdwards wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 12:01 pm

davesudweeks wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 11:38 amThis makes sense when we remember that Wards and Stakes don't "own" the buildings. Wards and Stakes are tenants in buildings they are assigned to meet in.

This also aligns with my experience when requesting physical keys. YMMV (since not all Stakes and FM Groups are created alike), but the times that I was personally involved in requesting new keys, we went through the Stake HC who then sent the request on to the FM Group.

Whether a calling is Synchronized with LCR or not, is not the same as requesting additional physical keys.
The number of Licences/(Keys in previous terms), has already been allocated to the Stake, 50 for the Stake and 20 for each ward.
There are two methods of assigning a licence to a member which are, Synchronization between LCR and Kindoo, or manual assignment of the Licences by the Stake Kindoo manager for a user.
The ability for the Stake to choose which callings are Synced with LCR to get a licence, should not need to be done by having to go to the FM to do it, It's simply a choice made by the Stake, so the Stake Kindoo manager should be able to manage which callings are synced directly.

sbradshaw wrote: Tue Nov 04, 2025 4:26 pm

russellhltn wrote: Tue Nov 04, 2025 10:33 am

martelldansie wrote: Mon Nov 03, 2025 11:25 pm I also would like to note my disappointment in the fact that we are going away from FOBs.

FOBs have many of the same problems as keys. They have to be tracked. They can also be swiped or loaned out inappropriately. During one of the safety briefings we've had, we were told about the wayward child of a released church leader who got their hands on dad's keys and trashed the meetinghouse. Dad still had the keys because no one wanted to take the keys back from the released leader. With the Kindoo system, the son would have to take the phone. And once released, a leader's access is revoked automatically. Given the ongoing cost of Kindoo, I'm sure the leaders weighed the options, but valued the security and linking to one's calling other more common methods.

It may be a step back in user convivence, but a step up in security.

FOBs that rely on simple RFID or NFC can also be easily duplicated/cloned to other devices. The Kindoo app connects to the internet to authenticate with a rotating code that changes frequently, making it much harder to clone (if I'm understanding the technology correctly).

I would think if the church is trying to increase the security of the buildings (I almost said "our" buildings, but would have been corrected) that all exterior doors would have some sort of auto locking feature. Thus the buildings would be more secure after activities. I have performed building lockup and sometimes I have found the building unlocked on a Monday night when there shouldn't have been anything in the building since Sunday. I still think members securing the "church's buildings" is a good think.

The member's really do have a sense of ownership when the meet in a building weekly and help clean the buildings and clear the snow. It is sad that it is being acknowledged in such a way that may alienate some members from wanting to even go to the buildings. I am glad this isn't a public forum because that would probably be a hot topic. Central governance of the church is powerful and amazing and is definitely a house of "order" and the Lord's Way. Not complaining just concerned about the message that is being sent. Many old members were in the church when we had to raise funds to build "our" local meeting houses. Thanks for listening.

martelldansie wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 9:11 pm I would think if the church is trying to increase the security of the buildings (I almost said "our" buildings, but would have been corrected) that all exterior doors would have some sort of auto locking feature.

Good point. Kindoo might address that.

martelldansie wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 9:11 pm Thus the buildings would be more secure after activities. I have performed building lockup and sometimes I have found the building unlocked on a Monday night when there shouldn't have been anything in the building since Sunday.

I've walked into a gym with the lights on, A/C running, and an open package of cookies on a chair - and no one around. I suspected it was the handiwork of the missionaries having a P day.

martelldansie wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 9:11 pm I am glad this isn't a public forum because that would probably be a hot topic.

This is a public forum. No login is required to read, and Google searches sometimes points to messages on here.

Do Temp users get automatically deleted?
This is what the wiki instructions say, but isn't fully clear if they are automatically deleted of if it has to be done manually.

9. Toggle the field "Temporary user" if the person's access should expire after a certain date. Complete the section specifying when their rights should be activated and expire. Note that the individual will still use a user seat until their access expires and they are removed from the system.

https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... _to_Kindoo

ELHawkes wrote: Sat Nov 08, 2025 10:30 am Do Temp users get automatically deleted?
This is what the wiki instructions say, but isn't fully clear if they are automatically deleted of if it has to be done manually.

Yes, temporary users are automatically deleted the second the expiration date and time occur. The license then returns to the pool of available licenses.

rknelson wrote: Sat Nov 08, 2025 11:43 am

ELHawkes wrote: Sat Nov 08, 2025 10:30 am Do Temp users get automatically deleted?
This is what the wiki instructions say, but isn't fully clear if they are automatically deleted of if it has to be done manually.

Yes, temporary users are automatically deleted the second the expiration date and time occur. The license then returns to the pool of available licenses.

Very good, thanks for letting us know.

Resend All

Is there a way to resend to all users who have not accepted the Kindoo invitation instead of just one at a time?

Check to see if there are any users that have not accepted the Kindoo invitation that could potentially be removed. In the Users menu, look for users that have the “Resend Email” link. These users have not accepted the Kindoo invitation and could be removed.

ELHawkes wrote: Sat Nov 08, 2025 5:44 pm Is there a way to resend to all users who have not accepted the Kindoo invitation instead of just one at a time?

The easiest way is probably to go to the "Site Dashboard" option. Choose "Export raw data to CSV". You can then filter that list by your choice of users who have never accepted/verified/logged in or have never unlocked a door. You can then copy and paste those email addresses to a bulk email.

swigginton wrote: Sat Nov 08, 2025 6:27 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Sat Nov 08, 2025 5:44 pm Is there a way to resend to all users who have not accepted the Kindoo invitation instead of just one at a time?

The easiest way is probably to go to the "Site Dashboard" option. Choose "Export raw data to CSV". You can then filter that list by your choice of users who have never accepted/verified/logged in or have never unlocked a door. You can then copy and paste those email addresses to a bulk email.

That's a great idea, thanks a bunch.

russellhltn wrote: Wed Nov 05, 2025 8:55 pm
If there's no pressure to limit the number of licenses, then why not just give everyone access? Far less work to manage that way.

I think there's wisdom of keeping wards/stakes just a little "hungry" so they manage their license to those who who have an actual need for it.

I guess that is one way to look at it. Not having enough licenses provides an easy excuse to say "no" when someone you don't want to have access asks for it.

I personally think the limited access approach makes more sense when dealing with physical locks; The "high security" cylinders (Medeco, Assa, Mul-T-Lock,...) do have some additional [often significant] costs with key duplication and rekeying a system so tracking each key is essential.

With a computerized system (Kindoo et. al.) the authorization keys should be per-user and immensely more secure than the exterior "high security" physical keys. In reality, if someone qualifies for a temple recommend, they should be fine with access to the building. In a computerized system, access is easily audited and can be revoked on a per-user basis.

I find the artificial license limit frustrating and shortsighted. Assuming our stake chooses to assign licenses to the full Bishopric with clerks and executive secretaries, that would be 8 of our 20, up to 10 if we added more allowed assistants in LCR. Add 5 org presidents (EQ, RS, YW, SS, Primary) takes us to 13. Hope that the presidents are always available for their organization's events. Can't fallback on a counselor or secretary. We currently have 3 tech specialists, 4 building reps (2 long term security, 2 short term cleaning), 4 Valiant Activity Leaders (2 couples, one for boys, one for girls). It wouldn't take much to breach our ward limit if the stake selects any standard callings that accept multiple members simultaneously.

Do we start converting standard callings to custom callings to avoid hitting artificial limits? Example: We pull our short- term cleaning reps out of the standard building rep calling for a custom calling, which we've avoided. Let the Kindoo licensing drive our LCR behavior? Do we petition the stake and FM group to minimize the automated callings chosen to avoid hitting the artificial limits, but then create more manual work to handle temporary and specialized license assignments?

If licenses are exorbitantly expensive, then that appears to be poor contract negotiation with the vendor for the scale of installations. If licenses are reasonably priced, then setting an initial artificial limit lower than the core leadership of a ward seems to be extra friction than needful.

We made a recent change, where if the stake needs additional licenses more than the initial amount you can request those through the FM group immediately rather then waiting a few months. You shouldn’t have to worry about removing people from synchronized callings. So going forward if you have multiple people in a calling you can request additional licenses to cover them. There is a cost for each license but it is permanently tied to a stake and not transferable between stakes and so we were trying to be cautious about how many were purchased.

I am part of the implementation team. We are still providing guidelines out to the FMs so if you have specific concerns please send me a private message.
Thank you all for your feedback.

waymana wrote: Thu Oct 30, 2025 10:32 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Oct 30, 2025 8:41 am We have been told that there will initially be
50 licenses allocated to the Stake,
20 licenses allocated to each Ward,
we have not been able to get an answer if there are additional licenses allocated for branch leadership. We have two branches in our Stake.
Does anyone know if additional licenses are allocated for branches?

It is 20 licenses for each ward or branch. All the licenses are aggregated at the stake level for the buildings in the stake. A stake with 5 wards or branches would receive 150 licenses. So if a branch or ward doesn't need as many licenses, others in the stake could use them.

We have two branches in our Stake.
We asked for just 2 extra licences for each Branch and got none.

ELHawkes wrote: Sat Nov 08, 2025 9:17 pm

waymana wrote: Thu Oct 30, 2025 10:32 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Oct 30, 2025 8:41 am We have been told that there will initially be
50 licenses allocated to the Stake,
20 licenses allocated to each Ward,
we have not been able to get an answer if there are additional licenses allocated for branch leadership. We have two branches in our Stake.
Does anyone know if additional licenses are allocated for branches?

It is 20 licenses for each ward or branch. All the licenses are aggregated at the stake level for the buildings in the stake. A stake with 5 wards or branches would receive 150 licenses. So if a branch or ward doesn't need as many licenses, others in the stake could use them.

We have two branches in our Stake.
We asked for just 2 extra licences for each Branch and got none.

FMs were informed yesterday of this change.

waymana wrote: Sat Nov 08, 2025 8:49 pm We made a recent change, where if the stake needs additional licenses more than the initial amount you can request those through the FM group immediately rather then waiting a few months. You shouldn’t have to worry about removing people from synchronized callings. So going forward if you have multiple people in a calling you can request additional licenses to cover them. There is a cost for each license but it is permanently tied to a stake and not transferable between stakes and so we were trying to be cautious about how many were purchased.

I am part of the implementation team. We are still providing guidelines out to the FMs so if you have specific concerns please send me a private message.
Thank you all for your feedback.

We asked for the stake music coordinator to be synchronized as one of our choices, but instead the ward music coordinators were synchronized that we didn't ask for and so I manually added the stake music coordinator.
That tied up six extra licenses for users I cannot delete nor can I get any response from the FM to give me access to delete them, nor get the music coordinators from being synchronized.
The support from the FM for this transition from one electronic system to another has been quite poor in many ways.

ELHawkes wrote: Sat Nov 08, 2025 9:57 pm The support from the FM for this transition from one electronic system to another has been quite poor in many ways.

I suppose YMMV with each FM group? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Two members having the same email address
I have an EQ president that was added via calling synchronization and he was not given any access to the doors in his building.
I had to add his door access manually.
I discovered that he and his wife use the same email address in their LDS account profile.
Does anyone know if it causes issues with auto synchronization of callings when an email address is used for More than one member in their LDS account profiles?
Thanks,
Larry H

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 11:53 am Does anyone know if it causes issues with auto synchronization of callings when an email address is used for More than one member in their LDS account profiles?

That will definitely cause an issue, since the user accounts in Kindoo are based on a unique email address. I suspect if you update EQ president's membership record with a new email address, it won't trigger a Sentry update, so you'll need to manually add that one to Kindoo.

swigginton wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 12:31 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 11:53 am Does anyone know if it causes issues with auto synchronization of callings when an email address is used for More than one member in their LDS account profiles?

That will definitely cause an issue, since the user accounts in Kindoo are based on a unique email address. I suspect if you update EQ president's membership record with a new email address, it won't trigger a Sentry update, so you'll need to manually add that one to Kindoo.

Very good, thanks a bunch.

Just as a side note, after Kindoo was installed this past Wednesday, the Stake Pres invited me to attend the bishopric training meeting on Thursday to explain the Kindoo system to them.
One Bishop only uses a flip phone and indicated that he will continue to use his emergency key to access the emergency door that is still keyed.
Another Bishop put his 20 Licences up for auction to the highest bidder.
This is causing a lot of frustration in general to say the least.

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 12:34 pm

swigginton wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 12:31 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 11:53 am Does anyone know if it causes issues with auto synchronization of callings when an email address is used for More than one member in their LDS account profiles?

That will definitely cause an issue, since the user accounts in Kindoo are based on a unique email address. I suspect if you update EQ president's membership record with a new email address, it won't trigger a Sentry update, so you'll need to manually add that one to Kindoo.

Very good, thanks a bunch.

We have had KINDOO for over a year; the only issue was that if both family members had the same email address, they both received the request. Only one needed the access

We installed KINDOO a year ago in one of our buildings after they could not get parts for our old system. I received a phone call at noon. To pass out codes by that evening.. It's not so bad if you have a list. Names, email addresses, and callings to do the bulk upload. I was working from scratch at that point, 'cause I couldn't get a hold of anyone to generate a list of callings with emails and names.

Not having autosyn has not been a problem. I send a list to each ward to review of who has access and how many times they have used it in the last X
Once we start using the system, it works fine.. Looking forward to using the Autosync. But definitely going to go through the list and scrub some of those callings out.

After having the system in for a year, I still have people who have never used it to access any doors. I do turn them off every so often..
We are adding it to 3 others soon.

Our original count. The number of licenses was much smaller than what they were issuing now, and they have not had a problem with not having enough licenses.. I can see where the. Autosync. If it's sent to everyone, it can use up licenses very quickly. The nice thing is that wards, branches, or stakes that do not use all of their license can be used where needed.

As for non-members, I have an FSS with a large number of non-member Volunteers who have already been given keys. We will add that building to KINDOO, and then we will be able to track better who has access. They all have non-member LDS.ORG accounts
Kinddo is a lot cheaper than rekeying a building.
I get more calls from the missionary. After the transfer, I am trying to set up the phone in the new ward. i made a cheat sheet and gave it to them, which cut down some of the calls

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 4:37 pm One Bishop only uses a flip phone and indicated that he will continue to use his emergency key to access the emergency door that is still keyed.

When we've trained our stakes, this sometimes comes up. Our recommendation is to find someone in the stake who just upgraded their phone and still has the old phone laying around unused. There will be several. Configure that phone to use the Liahona WiFi network and install Kindoo. That becomes the access key for the flip phone member. In your case, the bishop will have his hard key, so he's fine until he gets another calling needing access .

swigginton wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 6:00 pm Our recommendation is to find someone in the stake who just upgraded their phone and still has the old phone laying around unused. There will be several. Configure that phone to use the Liahona WiFi network and install Kindoo. That becomes the access key for the flip phone member.

The app requires iOS 15.1 or later. I couldn't find a minimum for Android.

swigginton wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 6:00 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 4:37 pm One Bishop only uses a flip phone and indicated that he will continue to use his emergency key to access the emergency door that is still keyed.

When we've trained our stakes, this sometimes comes up. Our recommendation is to find someone in the stake who just upgraded their phone and still has the old phone laying around unused. There will be several. Configure that phone to use the Liahona WiFi network and install Kindoo. That becomes the access key for the flip phone member. In your case, the bishop will have his hard key, so he's fine until he gets another calling needing access .

It sounds like the workaround is that instead of having fobs that members can simply use old smart phones on wifi and then they will be in the same position as they were in the past with the fobs. Able to share the device with whoever they want, for convenience sake. That was the first thought that everyone in the room had when this suggestion was made.

I am not sure how building lock up is supposed to be handled when a member of the EL doesn't have access but is willing to do lock up for the week. I can see that ultimately someone will use the above hack as a workaround to allow for this EL to help secure the building.

russellhltn wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 10:16 pm

swigginton wrote: Sun Nov 09, 2025 6:00 pm Our recommendation is to find someone in the stake who just upgraded their phone and still has the old phone laying around unused. There will be several. Configure that phone to use the Liahona WiFi network and install Kindoo. That becomes the access key for the flip phone member.

The app requires iOS 15.1 or later. I couldn't find a minimum for Android.

It looks like Kindoo currently requires Android 8 and up, WiFi, and Bluetooth Low Energy. These days you can get a super cheap bare-bones Android phone for around $50. It would be interesting to test the limits and see if something like that would work.

User changes email address

This probably won't happen very often, but what happens when a user that has been added via calling sync and has been using the Kindoo app to open doors, but then decides to change the email address they use and so they update there LDS profile with a new email address?

Does the Kindoo app keep working with their old email address?
Or does it automatically get re-synced with the new email and either keep working or stop working?
Does anyone have any experience in this type of Scenario?

mmacconnell wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 10:36 am I have created a Google form that they can fill out to request this access. But just wonder if others have maybe come up with a better solution.

Would you be able to share the google form you created. I am talked with doing just that.

Thanks!

sevenbak wrote: Tue Nov 11, 2025 9:15 am

mmacconnell wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 10:36 am I have created a Google form that they can fill out to request this access. But just wonder if others have maybe come up with a better solution.

Would you be able to share the google form you created. I am talked with doing just that.

Thanks!

Sure, here is our form:

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIp ... usp=header

ELHawkes wrote: Tue Nov 11, 2025 7:53 am This probably won't happen very often, but what happens when a user that has been added via calling sync and has been using the Kindoo app to open doors, but then decides to change the email address they use and so they update there LDS profile with a new email address?

Does the Kindoo app keep working with their old email address?
Or does it automatically get re-synced with the new email and either keep working or stop working?
Does anyone have any experience in this type of Scenario?

A variation on your question is what happens when someone new is called to a position that has a calling-specific email that is passed from member-to-member? There are many wards/stakes that have emails like WestlandBishop@xyz.com or NoviStakeClerk@xyz.com, and when someone new is called, the member changes their church account email to be that calling-specific email. I believe this should be as easy as the new clerk logging into Kindoo on their cellphone using their "new" church account email. This would then switch that user account to the new clerk's cellphone and remove access from the old clerk's cellphone.

My question is what happens if the calling change is made in LCR and Kindoo syncs the new calling, but the member has not yet updated their church account to use the calling-specific email. In this scenario, Kindoo would actually update its data with the personal email for the new clerk, replacing the calling-specific email. Would the member then need to ask for a manual change to be made to update their info inside Kindoo, similar to what @ELHawkes asks?

mmacconnell wrote: Tue Nov 11, 2025 11:08 am

sevenbak wrote: Tue Nov 11, 2025 9:15 am

mmacconnell wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 10:36 am I have created a Google form that they can fill out to request this access. But just wonder if others have maybe come up with a better solution.

Would you be able to share the google form you created. I am talked with doing just that.

Thanks!

Sure, here is our form:

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIp ... usp=header

Thank you!!!

mmacconnell wrote: Tue Nov 11, 2025 11:08 am

sevenbak wrote: Tue Nov 11, 2025 9:15 am

mmacconnell wrote: Sat Oct 12, 2024 10:36 am I have created a Google form that they can fill out to request this access. But just wonder if others have maybe come up with a better solution.

Would you be able to share the google form you created. I am talked with doing just that.

Thanks!

Sure, here is our form:

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIp ... usp=header

Can you share a link as described in this video so that we can make a copy of yours that we can edit for ourselves? Thanks in advance.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTxCP8P6V3o&t=87s

The dash board in the Kindoo site management has quit working when using a web browser. It never loads even after 2 minutes as the note suggest to wait.
It is working OK when using the app on a phone.
Is anyone else having the same issue when using a web browser? I'm using a chrome book and chrome on the phone.

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Nov 12, 2025 3:32 pm The dash board in the Kindoo site management has quit working when using a web browser. It never loads even after 2 minutes as the note suggest to wait.
It is working OK when using the app on a phone.
Is anyone else having the same issue when using a web browser? I'm using a chrome book and chrome on the phone.

Yes, I saw this yesterday. I sent a message to the Kindoo support folks about it.

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Nov 12, 2025 3:32 pm The dash board in the Kindoo site management has quit working when using a web browser. It never loads even after 2 minutes as the note suggest to wait.
It is working OK when using the app on a phone.
Is anyone else having the same issue when using a web browser? I'm using a chrome book and chrome on the phone.

Just got word from Kindoo Support that this is fixed. CTRL-F5 on the page and you should be back to normal.

swigginton wrote: Wed Nov 12, 2025 10:15 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Nov 12, 2025 3:32 pm The dash board in the Kindoo site management has quit working when using a web browser. It never loads even after 2 minutes as the note suggest to wait.
It is working OK when using the app on a phone.
Is anyone else having the same issue when using a web browser? I'm using a chrome book and chrome on the phone.

Just got word from Kindoo Support that this is fixed. CTRL-F5 on the page and you should be back to normal.

I had to look up how to do a CTRL-F5 on a Chromebook, but that worked. Thanks for you assistance.
Use the Function Key (F5) equivalent on a Chromebook.
If you need to specifically use the F5 function key input (for use in certain applications or environments):
Hold down the Ctrl key and the Search/Launcher key (the key in the Caps Lock position with a magnifying glass icon).
While holding those, press the Refresh key (the fourth key from the left on the top row, with a circular arrow symbol ⟳). This key acts as the F5 function key when combined with the Search/Launcher key.

ELHawkes wrote: Tue Nov 11, 2025 4:42 pm

mmacconnell wrote: Tue Nov 11, 2025 11:08 am

sevenbak wrote: Tue Nov 11, 2025 9:15 am

Would you be able to share the google form you created. I am talked with doing just that.

Thanks!

Sure, here is our form:

https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIp ... usp=header

Can you share a link as described in this video so that we can make a copy of yours that we can edit for ourselves? Thanks in advance.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTxCP8P6V3o&t=87s

Here is the Form we created for our Stake that you can use as a template. This link will first have you make a copy to your Google drive, then you can edit and publish your own version.
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1Nb-jYD ... u_T90/copy

Key or FOB duplication
It has been said that one of the main reasons for going with a particular system is to get rid of physical keys or FOBS because they can be easily duplicated, and because the duplication equipment is cheap.

When it comes to easy or cheap, what if you don't need a key, or FOB, or smartphone.

What about just getting some cheap equipment and drilling a hole through the glass and then use a metal rod with a 90 degree bend to go through the hole and pull the crash bar to open the door.

https://youtu.be/U_NtTBTGp20?si=SYXxpf0xAGSXkPgX

Just some food for thought if the expense for this system is really going to keep anyone out that wants to get in, I'm sure there are plenty of other cheap ways.

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Nov 16, 2025 8:58 am.....It has been said that one of the main reasons for going with a particular system is.....

If something's been said here in the Forum, it likely hasn't been said by anyone in a position to give an authoritative answer. Even those charged with implementation of Kindoo, are most likely not those in charge of high-level decision-making. I don't doubt that many Forum members have good insight, but I also expect that there's a lot of aspects to Kindoo (and all sorts of other Church tech), that us Forum members simply do not know anything about, so we're all just doing our best with limited understanding. And our input here in the Forum is unlikely to reach the eyes or ears of those in charge of decision-making.

Long way of saying I don't think any of us can state with certainty, the exact degree that cost factors into the decisions the Church is making.

Kindoo management option

One additional option for the Kindoo management interface would be an option to display/list all temporary users.
I have been using three leading 000 in the description of each temp user which makes it easier to do a search for temp users, but an option on the site dashboard to list all temp users would be very handy.

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Nov 19, 2025 9:21 am One additional option for the Kindoo management interface would be an option to display/list all temporary users.

You can export the user list and filter by the "Temporary user" column. I agree it would be nice to get a quick list of those users. I'll see if they can add that to the search in the Users list page.

I have a few questions.
One, what is going to be put into the. Description field. I currently use the Ward's initials, and then the calling. (RHW_Bishop) That way, when I export a report. I can see which members in a ward have activated and are using the system, and which wards are currently using it.

The second question is. The member has two callings that qualify them for autosycy. What will then show up in the description?.

We have one building that has been on KINDOO for over a year. What will happen to the current configuration when autosync is turns on.

It would also be nice to have a report. That will display. Who is using this system? And who has not used the system? Not just their name. But. Description of their name is. Like Ward, XYZ. First counselor.

User Description. Entry point Schedule name Controller PIN Date Action
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX RHW Bishop YORBA BUILDING 11/19/2025 8:00 Open

dlpyro1957 wrote: Wed Nov 19, 2025 10:22 am I have a few questions...
The second question is. The member has two callings that qualify them for autosycy. What will then show up in the description?.

Here's an example of the description field for a user that was added via LCR auto sync, and has two callings that are Auto synchronized.
Brigham City Utah South Stake (Technology Specialist, Stake Building Specialist)

dlpyro1957 wrote: Wed Nov 19, 2025 10:22 am I have a few questions....

It would also be nice to have a report. That will display. Who is using this system? And who has not used the system? Not just their name. But. Description of their name is. Like Ward, XYZ. First counselor.

In the Kindoo management interface , the Site Dashboard provides a lot of what you're looking for here.

In the Site Dashboard, two items under each pie chart are also links that you can click on to get a list.

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Nov 19, 2025 9:21 am Kindoo management option

One additional option for the Kindoo management interface would be an option to display/list all temporary users.
I have been using three leading 000 in the description of each temp user which makes it easier to do a search for temp users, but an option on the site dashboard to list all temp users would be very handy.

For all non-automatically assigned users, we currently put this in description for easy searching:
FLOAT-RECUR <building> <activity> <contact info> -- recurring events like pickleball, employment class
FLOAT-PERM <building> <activity> <contact info> -- permanent users like missionaries
FLOAT-ONCE <building> <activity> <contact info> -- one-time users like for a funeral
FLOAT-GENCONF <building> <activity> <contact info> -- users like accompanists, etc to review every 6 months - maybe general conference

Of course we are new at this, so this might change, but maybe this will be helpful to others.

Resend Email (All)

One more thing that would be handy would be to have a function/button that would resend the invite email to all users that have not yet accepted the invite.
I know you can export the list and then copy all of the email addresses and then use your own personal email to send out additional invites, but it would be much nicer if it was automated within the Kindoo system so it was just a click of a button somewhere in the management interface.
This would give those users several opportunities over a month or two with repeated invites, and then licences could be freed up from those who are not interested in using Kindoo to access the meetinghouse. They would then still be free to request access if they decide they really need access sometime down the road.

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Nov 20, 2025 8:27 pm Resend Email (All)

One more thing that would be handy would be to have a function/button that would resend the invite email to all users that have not yet accepted the invite.
I know you can export the list and then copy all of the email addresses and then use your own personal email to send out additional invites, but it would be much nicer if it was automated within the Kindoo system so it was just a click of a button somewhere in the management interface.
This would give those users several opportunities over a month or two with repeated invites, and then licences could be freed up from those who are not interested in using Kindoo to access the meetinghouse. They would then still be free to request access if they decide they really need access sometime down the road.

Click on "Site Dashboard" scroll to the bottom and click on the Green portion of the "Site Invitation" pie chart. It will display all users who have not yet accepted the invite and each has a "Resend Invite" button. Not quite the same as your request, but almost as easy.

rknelson wrote: Thu Nov 20, 2025 8:36 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Nov 20, 2025 8:27 pm Resend Email (All)

One more thing that would be handy would be to have a function/button that would resend the invite email to all users that have not yet accepted the invite.
I know you can export the list and then copy all of the email addresses and then use your own personal email to send out additional invites, but it would be much nicer if it was automated within the Kindoo system so it was just a click of a button somewhere in the management interface.
This would give those users several opportunities over a month or two with repeated invites, and then licences could be freed up from those who are not interested in using Kindoo to access the meetinghouse. They would then still be free to request access if they decide they really need access sometime down the road.

Click on "Site Dashboard" scroll to the bottom and click on the Green portion of the "Site Invitation" pie chart. It will display all users who have not yet accepted the invite and each has a "Resend Invite" button. Not quite the same as your request, but almost as easy.

Correct, that is the other way I would like to avoid.
We currently have 27 users that have not accepted the invite yet after 2 weeks of having Kindoo implemented in our Stake.
That method requires the 1st click to initiate the resend invite, 2nd click to choose if you want to be copied, 3rd click to acknowledge the invite was successfully sent for each user.
That's 81 clicks.
1 button click to Resend All, and maybe one more click to acknowledge are you sure or cancel, would be far simpler.

Account Verification & Users Login Pie Charts in the Site Dashboard

Could someone share a Scenario of how the data in these two pie charts can be useful?

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Nov 20, 2025 9:14 pm Account Verification & Users Login Pie Charts in the Site Dashboard

Could someone share a Scenario of how the data in these two pie charts can be useful?

I don't find those 2 charts to be independently useful. They, along with the the Site Invitation chart tell pretty much the same story about who has initially set up Kindoo on their device. I use "Users login" and "Users command" as the guides to determine who will likely use their access privilege and are my source for seeking out unused user licenses. The raw data from the charts can be helpful when troubleshooting for a specific user. Knowing if they accepted the invite, verified their email address, logged in and issued a command can help identify the source of a problem based on which step(s) they completed. Other than that, I don't find much use in those first couple of charts.

swigginton wrote: Fri Nov 21, 2025 12:27 am

ELHawkes wrote: Thu Nov 20, 2025 9:14 pm Account Verification & Users Login Pie Charts in the Site Dashboard

Could someone share a Scenario of how the data in these two pie charts can be useful?

I don't find those 2 charts to be independently useful. They, along with the the Site Invitation chart tell pretty much the same story about who has initially set up Kindoo on their device. I use "Users login" and "Users command" as the guides to determine who will likely use their access privilege and are my source for seeking out unused user licenses. The raw data from the charts can be helpful when troubleshooting for a specific user. Knowing if they accepted the invite, verified their email address, logged in and issued a command can help identify the source of a problem based on which step(s) they completed. Other than that, I don't find much use in those first couple of charts.

So basically the data from those two pie charts provide a little deeper dive into the efficient management and use of licences, since over all the push seems to be for less people having access in the name of security.
The manager instructions indicate that users can be deleted even if they were added via LCR auto sync, but I have found that not to be true because it's also been said that the FM has to enable that feature for the manager, and even though I have explain And provided links To my FM Regarding enabling that feature My FM cannot find that feature and just says That I shouldn't be requesting access to Sentry, and others on here say I shouldn't worry about deleting users that have been auto synced, and others indicate that we should keep wards a little hungry for licences by limiting the number of licences or we might as well just leave the buildings unlocked if everybody gets access. Others say that those who are making the decisions at the top to implement this system don't necessarily have an interest in the concerns mentioned in this thread. I have been told in this thread that I have an infinity for her previous Sicunet system.
I find this all to be a strange mix of opinions and politics of the business end of this effort. And then Spiritually we are taught to council together to know the correct path to take.
At any rate, I hope that Stake managers can actually manage more efficiently by getting these features implemented.
Being able to directly manage which callings are synced and not synced.
Able to directly deleted users that were added via sync
Able to resend invites to All, not just one at a time.
Able to list all temporary users.
Improve the Bulk add users by being able to specify which access rule each user gets in the CSV file and not be limited to 50 users per CSV file.

swigginton wrote: Sat Aug 05, 2023 6:25 pm

bradleyturnerj wrote: Sat Aug 05, 2023 5:44 pm For the individual talking with FM and the Kindoo CEO, it would be helpful if this app could enable other users 1x access rights. The use case is building cleaning (if ward members are coming to help earlier or later than the overall group) or building lock up.

The Kindoo app has the ability to add "temporary" users. You add the user and set a date/time when the access expires. Seems like that could cover what you are requesting. We use it for family activities, wedding receptions and other one-time use situations.

+1 for this with a slight edit -- if the expiration date automatically releases the seat/license, great. Though if I could then chain another person to take that *same* user seat later (after the expiration date) then this would greatly simplify access/license management.

example: Its Sunday. A backup person asked to check building for security just this week on wednesday night. gets access that expires that night. I schedule this today, and it uses one floating seat/license. someone else asks to come in and setup for an event Saturday morning, early. I "re-assign" this temporary floating seat/license to person B (the saturday setup person) to be able to get access to a certain set of doors on Saturday morning, expiring that day at 5pm.

only one license gets "used" either time *and* I can proactively setup the usage to swap from person A to person B, all done on Sunday before either of these events has happened, ensuring the members have sufficient time to download and register for the app, so that Wednesday night and Saturday morning, they dont need to call me in a panic because they can't get into the building.

This idea is more of a "parking space" than a fixed user license. I am sure this might be technically difficult depending on how Kindoo's system ties together on the back-end, but if there was a way even for a stake or building to have a few floating licenses like this, that would make the system exponentially more flexible.

(seems like this "guest" access enablement would be a pretty fantastic feature for Kindoo, too, in the long-run. I have to think it's a feature they have on their roadmap anyway!)

robmerrill wrote: Mon Nov 24, 2025 9:00 am
+1 for this with a slight edit -- if the expiration date automatically releases the seat/license, great. Though if I could then chain another person to take that *same* user seat later (after the expiration date) then this would greatly simplify access/license management.

example: Its Sunday. A backup person asked to check building for security just this week on wednesday night. gets access that expires that night. I schedule this today, and it uses one floating seat/license. someone else asks to come in and setup for an event Saturday morning, early. I "re-assign" this temporary floating seat/license to person B (the saturday setup person) to be able to get access to a certain set of doors on Saturday morning, expiring that day at 5pm.

only one license gets "used" either time *and* I can proactively setup the usage to swap from person A to person B, all done on Sunday before either of these events has happened, ensuring the members have sufficient time to download and register for the app, so that Wednesday night and Saturday morning, they dont need to call me in a panic because they can't get into the building.

This idea is more of a "parking space" than a fixed user license. I am sure this might be technically difficult depending on how Kindoo's system ties together on the back-end, but if there was a way even for a stake or building to have a few floating licenses like this, that would make the system exponentially more flexible.

(seems like this "guest" access enablement would be a pretty fantastic feature for Kindoo, too, in the long-run. I have to think it's a feature they have on their roadmap anyway!)

That's a great Idea.

Things we would like the Stake Manager to be able to do directly

Able to directly edit the names of access doors (forgot to add this one in the previous thread)
Able to directly manage which callings are synced and not synced.
Able to directly deleted users that were added via sync
Able to resend invites to All, not just one at a time.
Able to list all temporary users.
Improve the Bulk add users by being able to specify which access rule each user gets in the CSV file and not be limited to 50 users per CSV file.
"The floating parking space" Licence, as described here. posting.php?mode=reply&t=41853#pr260994

Stake Technology Specialist

As the Stake Kindoo manager with the calling of Stake Technology Specialist, there is a need to be able to verify all of the email addresses used in managing user access in Kindoo.

Stake Technology Specialists do not currently have access to "View Member Profiles", which is shown in "Feature Access by Calling" under the help tab in LCR.

Would it be possible to have access granted to Stake Technology Specialists to be able to "View Member Profiles"?
Or should there be a new Standard calling made for the "Stake Kindoo Manager" with access to "View Member Profiles"?

What other options might there be available?

ELHawkes wrote: Tue Nov 25, 2025 7:55 pm there is a need to be able to verify all of the email addresses used in managing user access in Kindoo.

What do you mean by verify? To see if the email has been updated in the membership but not updated in Kindoo?

russellhltn wrote: Wed Nov 26, 2025 1:50 am

ELHawkes wrote: Tue Nov 25, 2025 7:55 pm there is a need to be able to verify all of the email addresses used in managing user access in Kindoo.

What do you mean by verify? To see if the email has been updated in the membership but not updated in Kindoo?

To verify that the email addresses received for a building access request are accurate with no typos, or that is't an actual email address used in a members profile.
Since Kindoo is specifically set up to only work with actual email addresses that are in a members church profile, it is necessary to verify the email is valid.
The online request form I setup with the intent for only a bishopric member to submit for a member to access a building, I subsequently started getting access requests sent to me by the building scheduler and an individual.
For example, the building scheduler made a typo in the email address and when I inquired a few days later of that member, who was a friend that stopped by, if he was able to get the Kindoo app setup, he hadn't received the invite. But the email address, even though it was a typo, was a valid email address for his son, so his son in a different city got the Kindoo email invite. So then I had to delete the user and re-add with the correct email address.
Another example where I got a request via the online form was from a sister. So I looked in tools with the name provided and there was no sister in the entire Stake with that name. So I searched tools with the email address provided and still got nothing. I had my wife who is in the Stake Primary presidency search in tools with the email address and found that the sister was the wife of a bishopric member and had used her maiden name and also indicated she was a member of a different Ward. The request was for using the building for a dance practice which also raises the question if the dance practice is a business with paying members.
I contacted the bishop to get approval for access, which was approved.
So being able to verify email addresses and who is actually making requests for building access, the ability to "View Members Profile" is needed because so many members mark their emails and phone numbers, Private. So only certain callings can view that info. Currently Stake Technology Specialists are not one of them.

Notification Email to deleted users

It would be helpful to users if the Kindoo system sent a notification email to users that get removed from the Stake Kindoo system, either from a calling change and the auto sync removes them or the Stake Kindoo Manager removes them or they get removed because they are a temp user that gets removed automatically after their temp time expires.

This way users don't go to a church bldg and attempt to get in, because they don't realize they don't have access any more due to the 3 reasons for being deleted.

swigginton wrote: Wed Nov 19, 2025 9:57 am

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Nov 19, 2025 9:21 am One additional option for the Kindoo management interface would be an option to display/list all temporary users.

You can export the user list and filter by the "Temporary user" column. I agree it would be nice to get a quick list of those users. I'll see if they can add that to the search in the Users list page.

I just heard back from the Kindoo developers. They added this to the Users page. Just type "Temporary" in the search field and you'll see a list of all the temp users. It's currently available from the web and will be in the next app update.

swigginton wrote: Wed Dec 03, 2025 9:03 am

swigginton wrote: Wed Nov 19, 2025 9:57 am

ELHawkes wrote: Wed Nov 19, 2025 9:21 am One additional option for the Kindoo management interface would be an option to display/list all temporary users.

You can export the user list and filter by the "Temporary user" column. I agree it would be nice to get a quick list of those users. I'll see if they can add that to the search in the Users list page.

I just heard back from the Kindoo developers. They added this to the Users page. Just type "Temporary" in the search field and you'll see a list of all the temp users. It's currently available from the web and will be in the next app update.

Very nice, I just tried it in the app and it also works there already.

Kindoo email invite Suggestion

Could the Kindoo email invite be updated to include the link to these additional instructions.
https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... sandGuests
Thanks

Temp User Deleted before User expiry date and time

I had a temp user setup for today and they ended up calling me because the app wasn't displaying a door to open even though the system showed in advance when I checked, that they had accepted the invite.
I ended up driving to the Meetinghouse and letting them in.
I then looked them up in the Kindoo app and found that they were already deleted a good 4 hrs before I set the temp user to expire.
I then opened a User-list.csv file that I had previously saved to verify that the User expiry date and time was correct and it was.
Has anyone else experienced this and was there a solution?
Thanks in advance.

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Dec 05, 2025 6:23 pm already deleted a good 4 hrs before I set the temp user to expire.

Is there a time zone differential to account for?

greenwoodkl wrote: Fri Dec 05, 2025 7:34 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Dec 05, 2025 6:23 pm already deleted a good 4 hrs before I set the temp user to expire.

Is there a time zone differential to account for?

Nope, I'm using/selecting the Mountain time zone when adding users here in Utah.

May be there needs to be a log of deleted users that shows when they were deleted and if it was done automatically or manually.

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Dec 05, 2025 6:23 pm Temp User Deleted before User expiry date and time

I had a temp user setup for today and they ended up calling me because the app wasn't displaying a door to open even though the system showed in advance when I checked, that they had accepted the invite.
I ended up driving to the Meetinghouse and letting them in.
I then looked them up in the Kindoo app and found that they were already deleted a good 4 hrs before I set the temp user to expire.
I then opened a User-list.csv file that I had previously saved to verify that the User expiry date and time was correct and it was.
Has anyone else experienced this and was there a solution?
Thanks in advance.

A couple of things come to mind:
Any chance the time zone was incorrect? It should have defaulted to your local time zone, but it can be changed when configuring a temporary user.
I've also seen a few users select the "Leave site" option from the site page not realizing it removes them from the KIndoo site, so they get deleted.
I did a bunch of testing with temp users and it worked great, down to the minute, but that was a couple years ago. Something could have changed since. We also configure our temp users to have access for the full day (5am-11pm), rather than a narrow block of time, so we might not see this problem if it were a couple hours one way or the other.

swigginton wrote: Fri Dec 05, 2025 7:40 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Dec 05, 2025 6:23 pm Temp User Deleted before User expiry date and time

I had a temp user setup for today and they ended up calling me because the app wasn't displaying a door to open even though the system showed in advance when I checked, that they had accepted the invite.
I ended up driving to the Meetinghouse and letting them in.
I then looked them up in the Kindoo app and found that they were already deleted a good 4 hrs before I set the temp user to expire.
I then opened a User-list.csv file that I had previously saved to verify that the User expiry date and time was correct and it was.
Has anyone else experienced this and was there a solution?
Thanks in advance.

A couple of things come to mind:
Any chance the time zone was incorrect? It should have defaulted to your local time zone, but it can be changed when configuring a temporary user.
I've also seen a few users select the "Leave site" option from the site page not realizing it removes them from the KIndoo site, so they get deleted.
I did a bunch of testing with temp users and it worked great, down to the minute, but that was a couple years ago. Something could have changed since. We also configure our temp users to have access for the full day (5am-11pm), rather than a narrow block of time, so we might not see this problem if it were a couple hours one way or the other.

Nope, I'm using/selecting the Mountain time zone when adding users here in Utah.

May be there needs to be a log of deleted users that shows when they were deleted and if it was done automatically or manually.

The option to "Leave site" should then be changed to "Delete User Access" so there is less doubt about what that button does.

ELHawkes wrote: Tue Nov 25, 2025 7:55 pm Stake Technology Specialist

As the Stake Kindoo manager with the calling of Stake Technology Specialist, there is a need to be able to verify all of the email addresses used in managing user access in Kindoo.

Stake Technology Specialists do not currently have access to "View Member Profiles", which is shown in "Feature Access by Calling" under the help tab in LCR.

Would it be possible to have access granted to Stake Technology Specialists to be able to "View Member Profiles"?
Or should there be a new Standard calling made for the "Stake Kindoo Manager" with access to "View Member Profiles"?

What other options might there be available?

I would just request a list of emails from a ward or stake clerk.
"If stake organization leaders and high councilors need a list of members for planning purposes, they should request this information through the ward or stake clerk." https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/too ... s?lang=eng

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Dec 05, 2025 7:50 pm May be there needs to be a log of deleted users that shows when they were deleted and if it was done automatically or manually.

That log exists. It's just not visible to us. They log lots of stuff. It will likely show up for our use eventually, but possibly only at the admin level.

The option to "Leave site" should then be changed to "Delete User Access" so there is less doubt about what that button does.

Even "Delete User Access" wouldn't be obvious to some users. Kindoo currently displays, a pretty clear warning message when you choose "Leave Site", but apparently, users just click past it without paying attention. I hasn't happened a lot. Probably less than 10 times across the 4 thousand users in the sites I support, but it has happened.

waymana wrote: Fri Dec 05, 2025 7:55 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Tue Nov 25, 2025 7:55 pm Stake Technology Specialist

As the Stake Kindoo manager with the calling of Stake Technology Specialist, there is a need to be able to verify all of the email addresses used in managing user access in Kindoo.

Stake Technology Specialists do not currently have access to "View Member Profiles", which is shown in "Feature Access by Calling" under the help tab in LCR.

Would it be possible to have access granted to Stake Technology Specialists to be able to "View Member Profiles"?
Or should there be a new Standard calling made for the "Stake Kindoo Manager" with access to "View Member Profiles"?

What other options might there be available?

I would just request a list of emails from a ward or stake clerk.
"If stake organization leaders and high councilors need a list of members for planning purposes, they should request this information through the ward or stake clerk." https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/too ... s?lang=eng

That list could get out of date rather fast in today's world. Also many people are marking their phone and email as private and warning messages in tools and online indicate that they are not to be shared. So generating a list of the entire stake and passing it along probably isn't the best approach.

Site Dashboard-Never issued a command (in the past 4-6 months)

I can see that in the future, the data of "Never issued a command" would be more useful if a date range could be selected.
For example, if a user opened a door 8 months ago, they will not show up in the "Never issued a command" data.
But if a date range could be selected for the past 6 months in the "Never issued a command" data, then it would be more useful to know who is not needing building access very often.
I know you can look at a users log to see their activity, but it would be much more efficient to be able to generate a list of those who haven't opened a door in the past 6 months.
Instead of Never issued a command for a title, maybe it could say "Never Opened a Door".
Maybe someone already knows a way to generate this type of list of users that have never opened a door in the past 4-6 months.
Thanks for your consideration.

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Dec 07, 2025 9:56 am I know you can look at a users log to see their activity, but it would be much more efficient to be able to generate a list of those who haven't opened a door in the past 6 months.

I enjoy a good challenge, so through it would be fun to give this one a try. I was able to get that list in just a couple minutes, but it's slightly kludgy .

• Export the list of users to a CSV
• Export the logs to a CSV based on the date range you care to view.
• Open them both up in a spreadsheet
• In the user list, concatenate the first and last names to create the full user name column, because that's how it's listed in the logs
• Use VLOOKUP or a similar spreadsheet function to tag users in the user list who are found in the logs. Those not found are your target group.

Like I said, it's a little kludgy (maybe a lot kludgy), but it gives you exactly what you are looking for.

Instead of Never issued a command for a title, maybe it could say "Never Opened a Door".

Keep in mind, Kindoo is not the Church's software and only for doors. It's a product used in many places with many functions, including opening gates, turning on lights, a pretty much anything else you can dream up using a remote relay.

swigginton wrote: Sun Dec 07, 2025 10:30 am

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Dec 07, 2025 9:56 am Site Dashboard-Never issued a command (in the past 4-6 months)

I know you can look at a users log to see their activity, but it would be much more efficient to be able to generate a list of those who haven't opened a door in the past 6 months.

I enjoy a good challenge, so through it would be fun to give this one a try. I was able to get that list in just a couple minutes, but it's slightly kludgy .

• Export the list of users to a CSV
• Export the logs to a CSV based on the date range you care to view.
• Open them both up in a spreadsheet
• In the user list, concatenate the first and last names to create the full user name column, because that's how it's listed in the logs
• Use VLOOKUP or a similar spreadsheet function to tag users in the user list who are found in the logs. Those not found are your target group.

Like I said, it's a little kludgy (maybe a lot kludgy), but it gives you exactly what you are looking for.

Instead of Never issued a command for a title, maybe it could say "Never Opened a Door".

Keep in mind, Kindoo is not the Church's software and only for doors. It's a product used in many places with many functions, including opening gates, turning on lights, a pretty much anything else you can dream up using a remote relay.

Yes, I figured that Kindoo is not Church software, but just hoping that who ever interfaces with Kindoo from the church could arrange to make this type of list available.
This seems to be the only place for us to get Kindoo tech support and make suggestions that I'm aware of.
I would say that your spreadsheet skills are way above average, I got a good grin from your comment "Like I said, it's a little kludgy (maybe a lot kludgy)"
I'm definitely only an average spreadsheet user, and I typically only use G Sheets, so your explanation would be a new learning curve for me to produce the same thing.

swigginton wrote: Sun Dec 07, 2025 10:30 am . . . but it's slightly kludgy .

• In the user list, concatenate the first and last names to create the full user name column, because that's how it's listed in the logs

Nice, and I understand the answer. But my spreadsheet skills never graduated to the concatenation level, although I think I know what it means. [grin]

lajackson wrote: Sun Dec 07, 2025 12:02 pm Nice, and I understand the answer. But my spreadsheet skills never graduated to the concatenation level, although I think I know what it means. [grin]

Concatenation is easy and super useful Works in Excel and Google Sheets:
If cell A1 is first name and B1 is last name, just use a formula like this in C1 to get the full name:
=A1&" "&B1
The ampersand (&) is the secret sauce here!
I'll see if I can throw together a clean G Sheets example later to cover ELHawkes feature request. I think it could be useful.

Google sheets and newer versions of excel support textjoin which can be simpler especially if you are combining more than 3 cells.

=textjoin(" ",1,A1:B1)

swigginton wrote: Sun Dec 07, 2025 10:30 am

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Dec 07, 2025 9:56 am I know you can look at a users log to see their activity, but it would be much more efficient to be able to generate a list of those who haven't opened a door in the past 6 months.

I enjoy a good challenge, so through it would be fun to give this one a try. I was able to get that list in just a couple minutes, but it's slightly kludgy .

• Export the list of users to a CSV
• Export the logs to a CSV based on the date range you care to view.
• Open them both up in a spreadsheet
• In the user list, concatenate the first and last names to create the full user name column, because that's how it's listed in the logs
• Use VLOOKUP or a similar spreadsheet function to tag users in the user list who are found in the logs. Those not found are your target group.

Like I said, it's a little kludgy (maybe a lot kludgy), but it gives you exactly what you are looking for.

Instead of Never issued a command for a title, maybe it could say "Never Opened a Door".

Keep in mind, Kindoo is not the Church's software and only for doors. It's a product used in many places with many functions, including opening gates, turning on lights, a pretty much anything else you can dream up using a remote relay.

swigginton wrote: Sun Dec 07, 2025 2:23 pm
Concatenation is easy and super useful Works in Excel and Google Sheets:
If cell A1 is first name and B1 is last name, just use a formula like this in C1 to get the full name:
=A1&" "&B1
The ampersand (&) is the secret sauce here!
I'll see if I can throw together a clean G Sheets example later to cover ELHawkes feature request. I think it could be useful.

Site Dashboard-Never issued a command (Opened a door) (in the past (X) months) Spreadsheet workaround

So after several hrs of watching videos and practicing, I was able to make swigginton suggestion work.
To merge two columns in G Sheets, I used this formula after watching this video. =ARRAYFORMULA(A1:A&" "&B1:B)
https://youtu.be/Tcvv-tmZEEA?si=mKeX24mmvzuI4Sl7

To Match (Vlookup) two ranges in G Sheets, which was the harder part to find the best video example and figure out, I used this video.
https://youtu.be/GZ1bEXjdhFU?si=xurEk-B7VwrJdYrT

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Dec 07, 2025 5:13 pm So after several hrs of watching videos and practicing, I was able to make swigginton suggestion work.

Excellent! Well done! Those new bits of knowledge may help you with future spreadsheet quests.

Hello, my name is Ryan, and I am with locktronics. We provide Kindoo to the church. We did some research on your post and found the following:

After investigating, we found no issue on our end. The user in question (initials = J W B) removed himself. I can't put his actual name up here, but if you need more details, please reach out to us at locktronics.com. The user removed himself 4 hours earlier just as described. He will need to be re-invited. I hope that helps. Thank you and I hope you have a wonderful day!

ryanhales wrote: Tue Dec 16, 2025 1:36 pm Hello, my name is Ryan, and I am with locktronics. We provide Kindoo to the church. We did some research on your post and found the following:

After investigating, we found no issue on our end. The user in question (initials = J W B) removed himself. I can't put his actual name up here, but if you need more details, please reach out to us at locktronics.com. The user removed himself 4 hours earlier just as described. He will need to be re-invited. I hope that helps. Thank you and I hope you have a wonderful day!

Hello Ryan,
Wow I never expected I would get a direct response from locktronics. Thanks for taking the time to do that.
I was wondering, I have made a number of feature request/suggestions in this Kindoo thread, do those suggestions get considered from this thread or do the suggestions have to come from an official church person that works directly with locktronics?

It would be very nice for users to get an email notification when they are removed/deleted from the system, so they aren't surprised when they go to the meeting house and find they can't get in anymore.

It would also be nice if there was a log history of deleted users that the Stake Kindoo managers could access for their stake, that indicated when and how or what process deleted them.

Also if there was a way to generate an inactivity list for all users in the Stake within a given time period, would make it much easier to determine if some users don't need access anymore.

And if the Kindoo invite email could include the link to user instructions , that would be very helpful to.
Thanks a bunch for your support,
Larry

In the site Dashboard, there is a pie chart that shows
Users with unresolved device switching: 1
Users with resolved past device switching: 0
Users flagged as permanently resolved: 0

Is there a way to actually resolve the unresolved?
The one user that shows unresolved is the full time missionaries that use the same teaching area email address that is assigned for the Stake that they are currently in.

ELHawkes wrote: Sun Dec 21, 2025 2:55 pm In the site Dashboard, there is a pie chart that shows
Users with unresolved device switching: 1
Users with resolved past device switching: 0
Users flagged as permanently resolved: 0

Is there a way to actually resolve the unresolved?
The one user that shows unresolved is the full time missionaries that use the same teaching area email address that is assigned for the Stake that they are currently in.

Only site admins can mark them as resolved. We also get an email notification. Once you (the Kindoo manager) have researched the user and confirmed that the switching was not against the license agreement, you can notify your admin (typically FM manager) and they can mark it resolved. For missionaries, they should mark it permanently resolved, since it's expected that missionaries will change phones with each transfer. Other users can be marked as resolved for past device switching and will be flagged if they switch devices again. From what I've seen, a user is only flagged if the device transfer is suspicious. For someone just switching to a new device and not switching back, it doesn't seem to flag as suspicious.

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 10:29 am Turning off Auto Sync between Kndoo and LCR
If we were to choose to have auto sync turned off for any or all callings that are currently enabled, would turning off the auto sync between Kindoo and LCR automatically delete those callings/users out of Kindoo, or would they remain in Kindoo for manual management?

This is a great question. I am guessing YES, but we are going to try this out in our stake. I'll let you know what happens.

I have callings which requires me to have access to 3 different stakes (sites) . Does this require 3 separate seats purchased?
Seams there should be a way to use the same purchased seat for multiple sites.

Thanks

barrettjt wrote: Sun Jan 04, 2026 11:15 am I have callings which requires me to have access to 3 different stakes (sites) . Does this require 3 separate seats purchased?

The licenses are issued by site (stake), not by user. So, yes, you need a seat issued by each stake. We see this situation occasionally. For example, we've given access to the mission president for all stakes within his mission. Fortunately, it's not a very common situation.

joshbingham wrote: Thu Jan 01, 2026 11:59 pm

ELHawkes wrote: Fri Nov 07, 2025 10:29 am Turning off Auto Sync between Kndoo and LCR
If we were to choose to have auto sync turned off for any or all callings that are currently enabled, would turning off the auto sync between Kindoo and LCR automatically delete those callings/users out of Kindoo, or would they remain in Kindoo for manual management?

This is a great question. I am guessing YES, but we are going to try this out in our stake. I'll let you know what happens.

Hi, were you successful in having Auto Sync turned off?
If you were, what did you learn that you can share with us?
Thanks

Excuse me if this was already posted. It seems as though most of the license assignment happens at a stake level. Is there typically also someone at the ward level authorized to add/remove users and assign temporary licenses? Can there be multiple people at the ward level that can do this? Can this be done from the Kindoo app or does it require signing on to the Kindoo website?

cougs wrote: Wed Jan 14, 2026 8:22 am Is there typically also someone at the ward level authorized to add/remove users and assign temporary licenses? Can there be multiple people at the ward level that can do this?

Licensing is at the stake level. In the FM groups I've worked with, we only give KIndoo manager rights to a stake person (typically the Tech Specialist). We don't give authorization to the wards, because they would have access for the entire stake, which could create issues.

cougs wrote: Wed Jan 14, 2026 8:22 am Can this be done from the Kindoo app or does it require signing on to the Kindoo website?

The functionality of the app and website are pretty much the same. Kindoo managers can manage access from either.

swigginton wrote: Wed Jan 14, 2026 9:26 am

cougs wrote: Wed Jan 14, 2026 8:22 am Is there typically also someone at the ward level authorized to add/remove users and assign temporary licenses? Can there be multiple people at the ward level that can do this?

Licensing is at the stake level. In the FM groups I've worked with, we only give KIndoo manager rights to a stake person (typically the Tech Specialist). We don't give authorization to the wards, because they would have access for the entire stake, which could create issues.

cougs wrote: Wed Jan 14, 2026 8:22 am Can this be done from the Kindoo app or does it require signing on to the Kindoo website?

The functionality of the app and website are pretty much the same. Kindoo managers can manage access from either.

Thanks for the response! So there's a single point of contact in the entire stake, overseeing all buildings, to handle temporary access requests such as for wedding setups, family parties, random one-offs, etc?

Also, a very minor point but bishops in my area have authorized limited use of the gym for non-organized, informal basketball for ward members. This is usually accomplished through the borrowing of a key fob. With Kindoo is the only way this can happen is through the Stake Kindoo manager?

cougs wrote: Wed Jan 14, 2026 3:36 pm So there's a single point of contact in the entire stake, overseeing all buildings, to handle temporary access requests such as for wedding setups, family parties, random one-offs, etc?

In the training I've done, we recommend each stake has a primary Kindoo manager and at least one backup. Bishoprics and the stake presidency know to notify the primary manager each week as callings change. The backup manager is there if needed (primary manager is unavailable, etc.). The backup is typically the stake clerk or stake building rep (usually, whichever is more tech-savvy). It typically only takes couple of minutes to add/remove users each week, so not a big burden.
For temporary users, it's up to the stake and mostly depends on the frequency of those events. In my stake, we have 2 building schedulers who each cover meetinghouses in their part of the stake. We have given them Kindoo manager access, but they are instructed to only add temporary users. All permanent users are handled through the primary Kindoo manager. That makes it easy for the scheduler to handle the entire process for temporary use of the building. If you don't have a lot of temporary needs, the building scheduler can notify the stake Kindoo manager to add the temp user.

cougs wrote: Wed Jan 14, 2026 3:36 pm Also, a very minor point but bishops in my area have authorized limited use of the gym for non-organized, informal basketball for ward members. This is usually accomplished through the borrowing of a key fob. With Kindoo is the only way this can happen is through the Stake Kindoo manager?

For those, we have approached it in a couple of different ways:
It's likely someone in that group will already have Kindoo access and can be the one to unlock the building.
If that's not the case, or you want to designate a lead person for that activity, they can be added as a Kindoo user. I've seen stakes set up their lead pickelball, volleyball, basketball, Zumba, etc., person with Kindoo access. They just need to understand it will consume a stake license.
Good questions!

I went through all 28 pages of this forum thread and these are issues and considerations I haven’t seen really solved or addressed, or that should have been addressed:

No, FOBS are not perfect as other systems also are not. But they are practical and usable from a USER standpoint, and that is something the whole Kindoo process simply sweeps under the rug. Every user has to go through a setup process and go through it again, for example should the Liahona wi-fi be “forgotten” (used by many who already have a ton of wifi systems to connect to and try to keep lists down), or various some other “oops” issues. So what if an organization president loans a FOB to someone who needs to get into the chapel for some reason? And the alternative of loaning a phone is useless. Those old enough might remember the KISS principle: “Keep It Simple Stupid” and Fobs are that absolutely that compared to Kindoo.

If a nefarious person thinks there is actually something worth stealing in a building, they’ll find a way to get in without any real trouble anyway. One can wonder whether all the $$$ being spent on Kindoo is really worth it even in a worst case scenario of having to actually replace a chapel now and then.

Many people are changing to flip phones for various good reasons and they’re simply left out in the cold with this dreamy technology. And they definitely don’t want to carry around another “smart” phone just to get into a church building, whether it’s someone else’s “old” phone – which still requires a paid, active account with internet access, email installed, etc. – or not. And as someone already mentioned, it’s simple to pass that phone around just like a FOB.

And when Kindoo doesn’t work there’s this wonderful list of troubleshooting:
- Ensure you are standing 3–5 feet from the door and tap Open again.
- If the door still doesn’t respond, turn your phone’s Bluetooth off, then back on.
- Close and reopen the Kindoo app.
Oh, and you need to keep your phone charged all the time, and if it’s not that’s too bad; waste time charging it before you can go (or return) to the building to get in.

Email addresses are an absolutely screwball way to “track” or to use as authentication and are accompanied by a number of complications. This is once again another load of time and effort for USERS. Users end up getting the short end of the stick. Twice just in the middle of this week, my building’s users struggled with getting it to work even though they previously had it working. For one it took an hour to get a support person personally present and have the problem solved to gain entrance. And as already noted, if the poor user clicks on the “Leave Site” button they get to do the setup all over again.

Dependence upon a 3rd party web/electronic system opens up doors to the potential of long-term problems all by itself. Then there’s Locktronics, which apparently adds a 4th party into the mix.
- What happens if Kindoo gets hacked as a vendor operating system and gets taken down, needing major troubleshooting/restoration back to usability?
- What if something happens to Kindoo’s “cloud” operation?
- What happens if Kindoo goes out of business?

Considering the trouble caused for poor users, and as crazy as the world is getting and as fast as that is happening, are we really relying on this kind of whiz-bang technology?

PKSharp wrote: Fri Jan 16, 2026 2:29 pm I went through all 28 pages of this forum thread and these are issues and considerations I haven’t seen really solved or addressed, or that should have been addressed:

...
- What happens if Kindoo gets hacked as a vendor operating system and gets taken down, needing major troubleshooting/restoration back to usability?
- What if something happens to Kindoo’s “cloud” operation?
- What happens if Kindoo goes out of business?

Considering the trouble caused for poor users, and as crazy as the world is getting and as fast as that is happening, are we really relying on this kind of whiz-bang technology?

Thank you for your obviously considerable effort reading all ~280ish posts in the thread and for your extremely thorough analysis in boiling the issues down into one compact post!

There is a possible solution to the issues of what happens if Kindoo goes out of business or is otherwise unable to provide the services on which the Church relies: hold the security keys and other details, maybe even the necessary software, in escrow. That way, the Church could fairly quickly deploy its own (cloud-based) resources and keep building access available. That sort of thing is done in some business situations--for example, where a government department relies on a particular electronic component made by only one manufacturer. Having read about the collapse of Insteon and the loss of function suffered by most customers of that former business, I hope the Church has arranged for a solution to that type of risk.

Thank you for your concerns and feedback.

The Church is moving away from FOB readers for a few reasons. Many FOB systems are on older technology/systems that are failing and need to be replaced. While FOBs may be easier to use to gain access to a building, FOBs can also be duplicated, easily lost, or stolen. Although it is easy to hand a FOB off to someone else when callings switch or when someone needs to borrow a key, it will be different with Kindoo where for many calling changes can be automated and temporary access can be granted by a Kindoo manager. Where wards are more spread out this will be a blessing so that people don't have to drive to someone's house to pick up a key and then return it.

At the moment, there is not a great solution for people that do not have a smart phone and I am sorry you have had people to have trouble entering the building. Just to clarify you do not need to login to the Church Wi-fi to use Kindoo. You only need to use wifi if you don't have a cell phone data connection. Many issues with access should be able to be resolved either through the stake Kindoo manager with giving the correct access, the Global Services Department for issues with the Church Account, or through the Facilities Management group.

The Church has contractual provisions with Kindoo to protect the Church in case Kindoo goes out of business. There will also be physical keys available to the stake president and others in the case that Kindoo goes out the building can still be accessed.

Does a Kindoo manager also have to have to be assigned a current building access license? I was just thinking that as STS I do access the buildings from time to time, but not regularly. If the stake presidency made me an assistant Kindoo manager, could I just grant myself guest access when I needed to access a building, instead of carrying a full time access license? That would free up a license to assign to my assistant STS who does need to access the stake center on a more regular basis (he lives near the stake center, I do not).

Honestly the best-case scenario would be that very few people have full time building access licenses and if they could request guess access on demand using an automated system that granted access to pre-approved people, they wouldn't need assigned kindoo licenses. Of course Kindoo is in it to make a lot of money through whereas we are just trying to find a way to help stake members in the work of salvation.

" Just to clarify you do not need to login to the Church Wi-fi to use Kindoo. You only need to use wifi if you don't have a cell phone data connection"

In our building a poor sister who otherwise has a normal "cell phone data connection" couldn't get Kindoo to work until she connected to the building's Liahona wifi, and then "bingo" she could get the door to open. This seems common.

To add a little to my previous post, from Kindoo's own tech docs, if a devious person wanted to a cheap or broken screen phone of the same version could be wiped and restored from a backup of a valid user's phone, and that could be repeated for other simultaneous copies, and you'd suddenly have illegitimate phones/access out there. Yes there might be an initial phone access password needed to start the process, but it's possible. Admittedly that isn't likely, but where fobs go, while there are other issues, how often do they really get "copied" nefariously? I don't know, but would guess it's not very often, even though that argument continues to surface. And the little passive tags are dirt cheap, so replacing them can't be a cost issue when they do actually wear out or are lost (at which point the old one should be disabled anyway) compared to Kindoo. Pattern detection could possibly notice duplicates of either approach, but nefarious persons probably wouldn't bother anyway; as has been said, they'd just break the glass and do what they wanted.

PKSharp wrote: Wed Jan 21, 2026 9:57 am if a devious person wanted to a cheap or broken screen phone of the same version could be wiped and restored from a backup of a valid user's phone, and that could be repeated for other simultaneous copies, and you'd suddenly have illegitimate phones/access out there.

Kindoo knows and tracks the device ID and has software in place to deal with someone trying to access using the same account on different devices. Restoring from a phone backup doesn't copy that device ID, so Kindoo would catch that. Cloning a fob using a Flipper would be much easier and undetectable. As you inferred, a properly-sized rock or brick is a much simpler, lower cost, more convenient and lower-tech entry tool .

Just curious, has anyone had experience with the Kindoo Remote Control device? I don't believe they were installed as a standard option, but I think its a reasonable discussion idea.

https://www.kindoo.tech/controller

This COULD potentially (if i understand it correctly) allow someone to remotely unlock a door for a member who did not have a named license based on their calling OR a temporary license given.

Of course there are valid concerns with this idea;

-You would want to have some way to VALIDATE the one requesting access was at the door and not providing access for anyone else. So there is an -element of trust there, which is there no matter what method you use to grant access.
-The additional overhead of someone being able to grant the access so an increase in user administration which i am sure the FM offices would not want to have or a Stake President.

bradhokanson wrote: Mon Mar 23, 2026 9:10 am Just curious, has anyone had experience with the Kindoo Remote Control device? I don't believe they were installed as a standard option, but I think its a reasonable discussion idea.

My stake has these, and there are both good and bad aspects (also depending on the 'model' used; the ones in my stake are raspberry pis, but I have heard of ESP32-based ones that were apparently more problematic).

Yes, they do allow remotely opening a door, but the utility of them is limited by a few things:
1. They only work for a single door, and need to be nearby (bluetooth range), which means you also need power and a place to put it; most of mine are on POE, but the placement of two of them is definitely not ideal (heat concerns during summer months)
2. The access to use it is not ideal; only site Admins and Managers (if allowed by the admin) can use them to open the door remotely
3. They are not truly reliable; there has been a number of times where the unit has crashed and needs to be power-cycled to function again (it was bad enough with two buildings that I have a timer on their power supply to power cycle them every night)

Usually when I am letting someone into a building using the controller, I am on the phone with them at the same time to make sure they get it; the controller only unlocks the door for the same amount of time as the Kindoo app (3-5 seconds).

I have found adding people as a temporary user is usually more reliable than trying to use the controller, as well as being more flexible (they are not limited to one Kindoo door on a building with more than one)

bradhokanson wrote: Mon Mar 23, 2026 9:10 am Just curious, has anyone had experience with the Kindoo Remote Control device? I don't believe they were installed as a standard option, but I think its a reasonable discussion idea.

We initially installed these in some of our sites and only gave remote-open authorization to the Kindoo Admin (FM manager). The devices were not super reliable and we were eventually instructed by HQ to no longer install them. They also create a significant security gap if functionality is allowed beyond the admin level.

How are wards handling giving temp access to members that need access to clean the building? We're in the process of switching to kindoo and it kind of seems like handling the temp licenses each week would be busy enough to be a calling on it's own. Is there a best practice to make this a manageable endeavor?

mjgainer wrote: Sat Apr 11, 2026 3:23 pm How are wards handling giving temp access to members that need access to clean the building? We're in the process of switching to kindoo and it kind of seems like handling the temp licenses each week would be busy enough to be a calling on it's own. Is there a best practice to make this a manageable endeavor?

I've seen a couple different approaches here:

• Each ward has a "Cleaning Specialist". They coordinate the schedules, unlock the meetinghouse at the designated time, instruct and monitor the cleaning tasks and lock up afterward. That's how our stake does it, and it solves a lot of problems. You have a single, go-to person in each ward. They have Kindoo access. Cleaning is consistent because someone is tasked with overseeing the entire process. In the rare event they are unavailable, a leader in the scheduled group may already have access. Otherwise, temporary access can be given for those exceptional situations.
• Another option is to create a list of cleaning assignments that include a leader with Kindoo access on each "team". That leader is charged with unlocking/locking the building.

Other options require giving temporary access to a "cleaning lead" for the week. As you implied, that's a hassle

mjgainer wrote: Sat Apr 11, 2026 3:23 pm How are wards handling giving temp access to members that need access to clean the building?

How will temporary access be given to those without "apps" or "smart" phones?

ambldsorg wrote: Mon Apr 13, 2026 3:56 pmHow will temporary access be given to those without "apps" or "smart" phones?

As mentioned here: At the moment, there is not a great solution for people that do not have a smart phone..., this is definitely something each stake needs to address individually. And it applies for both temporary and normal access in those cases.

Here is a brief training video for Kindoo managers. https://churchofjesuschrist-my.sharepoi ... ZXcifX0%3D. This is an initial draft to gather feedback and will be replaced in the future.

This is a supplement to the materials found here. https://tech.churchofjesuschrist.org/wi ... structions

If you have questions or feedback please send me a private message.

Such potential - but then we micromanage and don’t let wards have any control and we don’t buy enough license for the ward to even function. -

I was told by the local FM that they have halted the rollout of the Kindoo conversion (at least in Mesa, AZ). Have any of you heard something similar?

Installations have been paused while new improvements to the Kindoo system are put in place and tested.

Can we know what the new improvements are or related to, so those of us that already have Kindoo can have an idea of what to be ready for?
Thanks,
Larry

waymana wrote: Sun Jul 26, 2026 7:23 pm Installations have been paused while new improvements to the Kindoo system are put in place and tested.

It's been a couple of months, any new updates you can share with us?
Thanks,
Larry