Modified events not updated

So, I had written a longer post expressing some frustration with the ongoing sync issues... how you really need a moderate level of tech skill to set up a google calendar and get it to appear as an option on iOS, and then hope the link doesn't stop working without you noticing it. But, I narrowed down my issue more before posting. My frustration with the unreliability of syncing remains but I think I can be more specific now.

Two weeks ago, I deleted a few events from our stake calendar and they were subsequently deleted when my google calendar synced up. At the same time that I deleted the events, I also modified another event and that one is not syncing properly. Has anyone else seen that issue? When I say it is not syncing properly, I mean that it shows correctly on lds.org but not on my google sync and not even on my LDS Tools calendar. I am going to delete today's event and repost it as a new event to see if that takes care of it.

From what I have seen, the majority of sync issues are not with lds.org, but with google (which I wish would give us the ability to manually refresh a synced calendar). But, the sync would be sooooo much more reliable and simple to set up if the nine minute refresh restriction were eliminated. With as much emphasis as the Church puts on calendaring, will that ever happen?

Thanks in advance for your help and responses.

lleach4 wrote:At the same time that I deleted the events, I also modified another event and that one is not syncing properly.

What did you change?

Something you might want to do is paste the synce URL into your browser. You should be rewarded with a iCal file that you can look though with a text editor to see what information is getting sent. Note that this trick is subject to the 9-minute limit as well.

lleach4 wrote:From what I have seen, the majority of sync issues are not with lds.org, but with google (which I wish would give us the ability to manually refresh a synced calendar).

I use Android, but from what I remember, there's a trick to getting it to manually sync. Something like turning it off and back on.

lleach4 wrote:But, the sync would be sooooo much more reliable and simple to set up if the nine minute refresh restriction were eliminated. With as much emphasis as the Church puts on calendaring, will that ever happen?

Not likely. The limit was put on later due to the server load. It seems some members decided to set their sync to once a minute.

I have done a little more experimenting. An existing event that is updated does not sync the update to the google calendar. For instance, we have a stake priesthood meeting in August that I listed as an all day event in January. Once we received specifics from the visiting authority, I modified the existing all day event and it never updated. So, I created a second event, naming it slightly different, and it did sync to google. However, on my iphone the time of the priesthood meeting is correct in the detail but it appears as an all day meeting in the time summary on the side. Whether this is on the lds servers or whether it is problem with how google imports the info, I am not savvy enough to say. I don't know the practical implications of it.

I had a similar instance with a stake council meeting that was scheduled for tomorrow. About two weeks ago we decided to push the meeting back a week so I changed it on lds.org. It has yet to sync properly with google so I am going to just delete it and create it as a new event next week.

I am not a tech guru but until we can sync directly with the church, I don't see the calendar ever being reliable. It worries me because so many members have been trained to rely on the electronic version of the calendar and - besides the fact that the average member doesn't know how to create a google sync (not to mention that not everyone uses google calendar) - the syncing just isn't happening correctly. IMAP email works beautifully. It will be nice when calendars sync as well as email does. The best thing for now is probably to try and get members to log in directly to lds.org or rely on LDS Tools.

lleach4 wrote:I have done a little more experimenting. An existing event that is updated does not sync the update to the google calendar. For instance, we have a stake priesthood meeting in August that I listed as an all day event in January. Once we received specifics from the visiting authority, I modified the existing all day event and it never updated. So, I created a second event, naming it slightly different, and it did sync to google. However, on my iphone the time of the priesthood meeting is correct in the detail but it appears as an all day meeting in the time summary on the side. Whether this is on the lds servers or whether it is problem with how google imports the info, I am not savvy enough to say. I don't know the practical implications of it.

The frequency of the sync is entirely dependent on the application that pulls the information from the Church servers. Some applications allow you to specify how often they pull the information, but in my experience most do not.

One way to determine if the Church servers are causing the problem is to go to your Google Calendar and remove the synced LDS calendar. Then create the calendar again, which will do a fresh sync using the current data on the Church servers. If that works, then you can be sure that the Church servers are providing the correct data.

I sync my Church calendar with my Google Calendar and it works fine. I haven't paid a lot of attention to exactly when updated LDS calendar information syncs to my Google Calendar, but it does happen eventually. It certainly takes several hours, and I think it's more like a full day in many cases.

My sync with google seems to take 24-48 hours. But I doubt I would notice that events were not syncing correctly if I wasn't the clerk in charge of the stake calendar.

I did a test. I created an event, downloaded the sync URL and waited for it to show on my Android device. I then moved the event back to the prior day. I then downloaded the sync URL again. Comparing the two sync files shows that the change is there.

I've also logged into My Google calendar and I've noticed that it has updated, while my Android is still showing the old time. I'll have to wait and see if that corrects itself. It hasn't been 24 hours since it first appeared, so I'm not worried.

I generally find you have to wait 24 hours before everything updates - at least for Church -> Google Calendar -> Android.

russellhltn wrote:I've also logged into My Google calendar and I've noticed that it has updated, while my Android is still showing the old time. I'll have to wait and see if that corrects itself. It hasn't been 24 hours since it first appeared, so I'm not worried.

Update: My phone synced. So I'm not able to duplicate the issue, but it does take time before updates come though.

I'm pretty sure there's a way to force the sync from the phone. It might be a good idea to do it before going into a leadership meeting.

Could you try the same type of test but instead of moving the event to a different day, just change the time?

Even if it works for you, it kind of proves my point. I am not a tech guru by any means but I am significantly better than the average person. If I can't get it to work after months of experimenting and a 8-10 point checklist to get it set up in the first place, how in the world can we expect most members to stay in sync?

The calendars on my Mac and ipad synced okay but the iphone didn't. I am downloading a different calendar app to see if maybe the native iphone app is a problem.

BTW, maybe I should post my checklist on here so a few others can verify what I did to see if anything looks off.

lleach4 wrote:Even if it works for you, it kind of proves my point. I am not a tech guru by any means but I am significantly better than the average person. If I can't get it to work after months of experimenting and a 8-10 point checklist to get it set up in the first place, how in the world can we expect most members to stay in sync?

At least on Android, all you have to do is the very straightforward setup of the Google Calendar to use the Sync URL from the LDS.org Calendar. Then the key ingredient that most people overlook is PATIENCE. That doesn't require anyone to be a tech guru, but simply to wait 24 hours or more before they should expect to see the updated event make the full cycle back to their device.

But even if you don't like that, I don't see what the Church can do about it. We've proven that the data provided by the Church servers on the Sync URL is updated essentially immediately, so the delays that require patience are all on Google's side.

I'm not familiar with all the pieces required to update Apple devices, but whatever the issues are with that technology, it seems clear to me that again the problems are not with the Church's sync process.

However, regardless of whose fault this is, the one thing we can all do to contribute is to help document where patience is needed, and what steps will make the sync work most smoothly. So your efforts are indeed helpful.

lleach4 wrote:Even if it works for you, it kind of proves my point. I am not a tech guru by any means but I am significantly better than the average person. If I can't get it to work after months of experimenting and a 8-10 point checklist to get it set up in the first place, how in the world can we expect most members to stay in sync?

I'm not sure what you mean. The only thing complicated in what I did was the monitoring of it to see where the problem might be. Other than the actual change, all I did was *wait*. I suppose it's possible that my monitoring triggered some updates that might not happen otherwise, but it seems unlikely.

I moved the event back two hours. I also downloaded the ICS file and saw that it was already updated. So it appears to me that the church is doing everything right.

So far my Google Calendar hasn't updated, but it's too soon to worry about that.

lleach4 wrote:The calendars on my Mac and ipad synced okay but the iphone didn't.

That sounds like a major clue. If some of your programs sync, then the problem lies with the device that didn't sync.

Also, be aware of the 9 minute throttle. You can't use the church sync URL until 9 minutes have elapsed from the last time. If your iPhone is trying to use the church URL less than 9 minutes after either the Mac or iPad, then it's not going to get a updated file. But you mentioned Google Calendar, if they're pulling from Google, then it shouldn't be a problem.

At this point both my Google Calendar and my Android phone show the new time.

Last night in presidency meeting, I received the stake conference schedule for 2015 so I added it to the calendar on lds.org. As part of that, I moved stake PEC in February a week earlier so it wouldn't conflict. This morning, the stake conference is appearing fine on all my devices and calendars. The stake PEC hasn't moved at all. Keep in mind, I made these changes last night within minutes of each other so they should have synced together.

I downloaded the ICS file and stake PEC did appear correctly in that file. So I checked my google calendar online and it didn't sync properly either. In this case, the issue is not with the apple devices or the mac, it is between google and lds.org.

There is clearly a problem with the syncing of google with lds.org unless my calendar is simply set up incorrectly. Because I am getting some syncing, I doubt that is the case, which brings me back to the original question of how we can be confident the average member will stay updated...

As far as how my calendar is set up, I created a new google calendar called LDS google sync and pasted in my url. Then I went to an obscure link (https://www.google.com/calendar/iphoneselect?pli=1) to make sure it appeared as an option to display on my iphone and ipad. I also deleted all my subscribed calendars that used the link. I then made sure my devices had my calendar set up as a CalDAV. (My understanding is that just turning on the calendar that is connected to your gmail account on the iphone doesn't sync properly.) Start telling the average member to make sure they set their calendar up as CalDAV and you will lose them immediately but most of them could create a subscribed calendar if that was a reliable option for syncing, meaning dropping the nine minute rule.

All that being said, I might have found part of the issue. We have another stake conference in August 2015 and I also posted that one and moved stake PEC one week. In the February case, I simply dragged PEC to the week before. In the August case, I wanted to see if it made a difference if I edited the event by manually changing the date rather than dragging it. The August PEC synced. I think dragging events to change the date, which is something I am prone to do, might be an issue. I am going to manually edit the February PEC to see if that works.

It doesn't explain why changing the name or time of an existing event that remains on the same day doesn't sync but maybe we are dealing with more than one bug.

You might want to give it more time. I would have expected everything to update at once, but perhaps if given another try, it will straighten out. I'm wondering if the additions are causing some changes to be missed. In my testing I only changed the one event, so I probably had a rather quiet "sync".

The August PEC is not synced correctly after all. I must have been mistaken. It's been five days now so I have to assume the meetings I moved in February and August 2015 are not going to sync. I did change the name of a fireside happening next week by deleting it and creating a new event.

That's what I am going to do from now on. Events that are modified just don't sync properly with google. I can't believe I am the only one who has problems or who has noticed this. If there is anything I can do to provide info for debugging, let me know. Thanks for your help.

What I find odd is that you're the only one reporting this. Usually if there's a problem we get a bunch of "me too"s. The calendar and sync is used heavily enough that I'd think someone would notice things not being in sync. The only explanation I have at this point is that most of us are probably not looking at events that far into the future. Either it self-corrects as the time gets closer or it's a recent problem that no one else has noticed yet.

Have you narrowed down if the problem is church-to-Google or Google-to-iOS? I think you've confirmed that the .ical file is correct.

It appears to be church to google. The .ical file is correct.

The other possible explanation is that I am pretty proactive about adding events which means I probably end up modifying them way more than others.

lleach4 wrote:The .ical file is correct.

In that case you may want to check in with the Google community. Perhaps there's something they are aware of. Or should be aware of.

Is there anything at all unusual about your account? Perhaps it's not "gmail" but some other domain that is serviced by Google? Perhaps an app account?

Mine is just a generic gmail account that I've had for a number of years. Probably the most common verity of Google account.

It's just a generic google account. I suspect it is something about the .ics file that google is not taking correctly. I suspect that google isn't recognizing the event as having been modified. Whether that is an exporting error on the lds side or an importing error with google, I can't say. It would seem like it was a google error but maybe there is something that meets the eye in the .ics file. If it is google it has to be a known issue. There are just too many people using their calendar. I am not sure I have the time to delve into on another forum either.

The PEC in Feb 2015 that I moved up one week is still showing on my google sync with the original date. Today I deleted the event altogether to see if it would disappear on my google calendar even though it is appearing with the wrong date currently. If it does disappear, that will be interesting. It will show that lds.org is still providing information about an event that google has with an incorrect date.

One thing that might be worth looking at again - how many devices/things are using your church sync URL directly? (Syncing with the Google calendar doesn't count.) As far as I can tell Google only syncs about once a day and I'm not sure how hard it tries. If it's trying within 9 minutes of some other device/service doing it's sync, it's not going to be able to update. (There is a 9 minute throttle on requests.) I don't see any way to tell when the last successful sync was.

I don't have anything else that syncs, so no conflict for me.

I unsubscribed all my devices to avoid the 9 minute issue. Only my google calendar syncs.

So, this is interesting. The stake PEC that I moved up a week in February 2015 did not update correctly when I modified it. It showed on 2/1 on lds.org and 2/8 on google. However, when I deleted it from 2/1 on lds.org, it deleted the event on 2/8 on google. So the calendars were communicating about the event and recognized it as the same one even though they showed it on different dates.

lleach4 wrote:So the calendars were communicating about the event and recognized it as the same one even though they showed it on different dates.

There's an event ID that's part of the iCal. I'm not sure how deletes are handled - if it's still part of the iCal but with a status of "delete" or if it's up to the receiver to scrub everything that came from a prior iCal but not part of the current one.

I assume you're checking your Calendar via a browser. Any chance this could be a browser caching issue?

I am checking my calendar with a couple of different apps and on the browser. The cache isn't the problem because none of them are updated.

There was another instance today that had nothing to do with me as I can only post stake events. We had a ward picnic scheduled for today but someone in the ward moved it to next week to coincide with our monthly open houses at the buildings. The event shows up as next week on lds.org but my google calendar has not updated. I noticed this earlier in the week but was waiting to see if anything would happen with it. I know other members in the ward are having the problem because someone posted on the ward facebook page asking if the picnic was still today.

If I am the only one reporting this, I wonder if there is a problem with just our stake. That seems unlikely. It seems more likely that people just aren't using the calendar very much and/or aren't reporting problems. I do think that being very proactive with the calendar is highlighting the problem, as I mentioned before.

We are having the same issue in our stake. Mostly it seems it happens with repeated events when the time is modified, the google calendar does not sync properly. It seems that from one account to another the sync is different. Some will get events updated, and others won't.
Looking at the iCal, it seems the event is updated, but google does not pick it up.

Hope this will be solved.

idefaye wrote:Looking at the iCal, it seems the event is updated, but google does not pick it up.

Unless there is something more subtle going on, it would appear to be a problem with Google. You might try putting the file though a iCal validator first, but I'd suggest reporting it to Google. There's not much the church can do about a bug on Google's end.

If you can figure out what triggers the bug, it would help them track it down. Are you changing something else along with the time and Google is only picking up one of the changes?

Is the issue related to the problem I am having as summarised by another user in another topic "Google calendar sync issue"?
"I'm trying to one-way sync my ward calendar to my Google calendar. It was working well last week, but suddenly it was not refreshing when calendar events changed. So I deleted that calendar sync from my Google calendar and requested a fresh url from the lds.org calendar site. When I tried to sync with the new url, I received the following error message: Could not fetch the url because robots.txt prevents us from crawling the url."
Would the "robot.txt" (what that may be) also be preventing updates of existing items appearing in google calendars while allowing new items? Has there been any recent changes in the robot.txt used on the church website?

I think there's two different problems going on. The OP to this thread said that some events were not updating, but if he deleted the event and re-created it, it worked. In the Google Calendar Sync Issue thread, updating is completely broken.

Today, trying again to delete the calendar url to add it again I ended up with the problem mentioned by richardgiles. So there is now no more way for me to test any further the current issue until this other one is resolved.

There seems to be a problem with modifying an event (continuing mostly) since the new "You Are Changing A Repeating Event screen was implemented" The text for the options have changed - the options are the same. "Only this event; Entire Series; All Following; Cancel Changes." When I select "only this event" I am getting the error message: "We were unable to process your request due to invalid data. Please check all fields and try again."
Remember when this happened before, it had to do with the system not recognizing the original calendar. I tried re-selecting the calendar and that didn't help. Actually nothing helps! I just have to cancel changes to get it to close. Thanks for your help!!! Judy

winnj100 wrote:There seems to be a problem with modifying an event (continuing mostly) since the new "You Are Changing A Repeating Event screen was implemented"

There is a known problem with editing. The developers are working on that.

Thank you so much!! Judy