Storing Fundrasier Credits in Other Account

Our ward's annual fundraiser for Girl's Camp/Scout Camp got moved beyond the actual dates of the respective camps. Now, having completed the fundraiser, some participants have earned money in excess of what they owed to attend camp (i.e., they paid in full and have now earned excess monies). Should we just hand them cash straight from the funds raised or deposit this money into the proper "Other" account and hold it there for another year with a record that certain amounts need to be allocated to certain individuals if they choose to attend campnext year? Our Other accounts were in absolute disarray until a few months ago and I would prefer to keep them as pristine as possible. Thanks in advance for your help.

fernsten wrote:Our ward's annual fundraiser for Girl's Camp/Scout Camp got moved beyond the actual dates of the respective camps. Now, having completed the fundraiser, some participants have earned money in excess of what they owed to attend camp (i.e., they paid in full and have now earned excess monies). Should we just hand them cash straight from the funds raised or deposit this money into the proper "Other" account and hold it there for another year with a record that certain amounts need to be allocated to certain individuals if they choose to attend camp next year? Our Other accounts were in absolute disarray until a few months ago and I would prefer to keep them as pristine as possible. Thanks in advance for your help.

It sounds like your ward is turning the policy detailed in Handbook 2, Section 13.2.8, upside down. The purpose of a fundraising activity is to help the organization pay for the camp when Budget funds and individual payments are insufficient. It is not to raise money for individual attendees. If there are excess funds from a fundraiser, they are certainly not to be given to the camp attendees; the only provision for returning excess funds is to give them to the people who actually made the payments.

Remember that the policy makes it quite clear that the camp is paid for out of funds in a specific order:

1. Budget funds.
2. If Budget funds are insufficient, payments from attendees.
3. If those funds are insufficient, funds from a fundraising activity.

So I don't see how it could ever be proper to take money from option 3 to reimburse option 2; that would be reversing the clear priority order specified in the handbook.

fernsten wrote:Our ward's annual fundraiser for Girl's Camp/Scout Camp got moved beyond the actual dates of the respective camps. Now, having completed the fundraiser, some participants have earned money in excess of what they owed to attend camp (i.e., they paid in full and have now earned excess monies). Should we just hand them cash straight from the funds raised or deposit this money into the proper "Other" account and hold it there for another year with a record that certain amounts need to be allocated to certain individuals if they choose to attend campnext year?

A youth's participation in a fund-raiser does not entitle them to any portion of those funds. Any impression that there is any pro-rated share in ownership of the proceeds is contrary to Handbook 2, 13.2.8, as aebrown mentioned. All fund-raising should be a group effort/activity as instructed in 13.2.8 p 5 and 13.6.8 p 1.

The best course of action in my opinion is to retain the excess funds from the fund-raiser for next year's summer camps or the equipment needed for those camps applied equally to all camp attendee fees. Any other use of those funds would be contrary to the Handbook instructions. Remitting any portion of those funds to any individual is not permitted.

There is one other option. Send the excess to Church headquarters following the procedures in Donations to Church Headquarters.

jdlessley wrote:The best course of action in my opinion is to retain the excess funds from the fund-raiser for next year's summer camps or the equipment needed for those camps applied equally to all camp attendee fees. Any other use of those funds would be contrary to the Handbook instructions. Remitting any portion of those funds to any individual is not permitted.

I would add to this my opinion that any excess funds should go towards paying for anyone else who did not raise adequate funds first and then, if there is still leftover funds, return it to the donors (though that is likely not a good option because they likely paid for a service, etc which was performed/delivered) if you want to keep your Other clean or leave it in your YW camp subcategory in AMFA (the "Other" designation is once again no longer in MLS).

Thanks for all of the input. We'll get it straightened out. Life as a financial clerk is difficult when leaders cut personal checks without speaking to the Bishop in advance and fundraisers are moved after payments for camps are due.

I believe there is also an audit question (26?) that refers to funds in the other account being used for their intended purpose in a reasonable period of time.

I guess I misunderstood the OP's question. I thought he meant that a youth had paid the full cost out of his own pocket, and then, when a subsequent fundraiser raised enough to cover all the youth in the ward, the youth was trying to recover his out of pocket payment. If that was not the original question, I am posing it now.
What about a situation where a youth pays for an activity out of pocket, but then is unable to attend. Should he get his money back? I understand that if you have a fundraiser and raise enough money to pay for all 10 scouts in your ward to attend camp, and then one of them can't attend, by no means should he be allowed to "cash out" his unused portion of the raised funds.
So it seems logical to me that if a youth paid for the activity on his own, and then the ward decides a fundraiser is needed to pay for that activity, and raises the money for all the kids, the original kid should get his original, personal, payment back.

Alan

funaddict wrote:What about a situation where a youth pays for an activity out of pocket, but then is unable to attend. Should he get his money back?

As long as the money is still available, I would certainly say yes to that question. If the youth commits to go and makes a payment, and then the ward makes a non-refundable payment for the activity, then the money can't be refunded. But otherwise, yes.

funaddict wrote:I understand that if you have a fundraiser and raise enough money to pay for all 10 scouts in your ward to attend camp, and then one of them can't attend, by no means should he be allowed to "cash out" his unused portion of the raised funds.

Definitely true.

funaddict wrote:So it seems logical to me that if a youth paid for the activity on his own, and then the ward decides a fundraiser is needed to pay for that activity, and raises the money for all the kids, the original kid should get his original, personal, payment back.

I suppose that makes some sense, but that means the ward is not understanding the Handbook. The very clear order in the handbook is: 1) Budget funds; 2) personal payment by participant; 3) fundraiser. So to say that option 3 is supposed to replace option 2 means that the fundraiser was not done appropriately -- it was not designed to fit the need that remained after personal payments, even though that is very clearly what it is supposed to do.

But if the ward has already gone ahead and done that and now has excess funds, I suppose the best remedy is to refund the personal payment. But in the future, the ward should follow the handbook and avoid the awkward situation.

Thanks for the reply. In my 4 years as finance clerk, I have been trying to educate the auxiliary presidents, and the bishopric on occasion, on the guidelines for funding activities. Although I attempt to follow those guidelines as closely as possible, here are my observations on the financing of activities, at least for the youth. 1) Budget - The budget barely covers the years' worth of weekly activities, temple trips, the occasional scouting overnight campouts, etc. If we used Budget funds to pay for the annual scout camp, girls camp, and maybe a high adventure, we would consume more than half of the entire ward budget for the whole year. 2) Participants pay -As for the youth and their families paying for the activities, we already have them contribute between $50 and $150 each, in addition to money raised in a 3) fundraiser. It's hard to pin down the expense of an activity far enough in advance to know exactly what your fundraising needs are going to be. In my experience we never know the cost of the activity until after it's over, and the reimbursement requests come in, and the bill from the stake comes in, and we get a count of how many people actually attended.
Let's say we had an accurate cost ahead of time and asked each participant to contribute $100 toward the cost and decided we still needed to raise $2500 in a fundraiser. If we had a spaghetti feed fundraiser, and we raised the $2500 by pre selling tickets, then what do we do with the rest of the people who want to attend, and haven't purchased tickets yet, or prefer to pay at the door? Do we limit the spaghetti feed to only those first people with tickets?(only raising the funds needed.) Do we allow the rest of the people to attend for free?( In essence, selling them a ticket and then returning it back to them as excess raised funds)
The logical thing would be to sell as many tickets as people want to buy, and either roll that money over towards next years activity, or use it to reduce the cost that each youth has to contribute. It seems that either way you are going to be contrary to the handbook's instructions.
These are the types of discussions I have had with the YW, YM, and scouting leaders.
Any suggestions or opinions?
Alan

funaddict wrote:If we had a spaghetti feed fundraiser, and we raised the $2500 by pre selling tickets, then what do we do with the rest of the people who want to attend, and haven't purchased tickets yet, or prefer to pay at the door? Do we limit the spaghetti feed to only those first people with tickets?(only raising the funds needed.) Do we allow the rest of the people to attend for free?( In essence, selling them a ticket and then returning it back to them as excess raised funds)

(I'm assuming that the rules regarding the use of the kitchen and local laws regarding food are being obeyed.) I'd think the logical thing would be to have a fixed number of tickets printed and when they're sold out, they're sold out. Sales at the door would only be if not all are sold by pre-sale. That way you'd know exactly how many people to prepare for - another problem if you sell to as many as want to come.

funaddict wrote:It's hard to pin down the expense of an activity far enough in advance to know exactly what your fundraising needs are going to be. In my experience we never know the cost of the activity until after it's over, and the reimbursement requests come in, and the bill from the stake comes in, and we get a count of how many people actually attended.

There are going to be some variables for which you cannot plan to exactness. One of those would be move-ins before the camp, or similar event, too close to the event to make adjustments. Some of those apparently unforeseen expenses you mentioned, such as reimbursement requests, can be minimized with adequate planning. But I understand and empathize since I have been there before and hopefully we learn from our experiences in planning for those years yet to come.

Part of the planning process involves making the decision to have a fund-raiser and what to do with the excess funds should that fortunate outcome arise. Having an excess of funds from a fund-raiser is a good problem to have. How many times have you had a fund-raiser fall short and not be able to meet the expected expenses?

funaddict wrote:The logical thing would be to sell as many tickets as people want to buy, and either roll that money over towards next years activity, or use it to reduce the cost that each youth has to contribute. It seems that either way you are going to be contrary to the handbook's instructions.

When setting out to embark on a fund-raiser the potential outcomes should be considered. Having an overly successful one is but a small problem to deal with. One option in dealing with the excess funds that I have already mentioned seems to be ignored when considering options. I think that it is ignored is because there seems to be a sense of ownership of the excess funds. This sense of ownership makes it difficult to let those funds go to help others. Why not remit those excess funds to Church headquarters for the benefit of others?

jdlessley wrote:Why not remit those excess funds to Church headquarters for the benefit of others?

I believe that if you have a "Ward Boy Scout Camp Fundraiser" (for example), that you have a fiduciary responsibility to see that ALL of the money raised is eventually spent for that purpose, even if you have to hold a balance for a year or more. I realize that this conflicts with the "Don't hold a balance in the Other/Member Funded Activities Accounts" instruction.