Official name vs Preferred name

Why doesn't the name in the Ward Directory listing match the name in the expanded view of the same person? For example, if the "official" name were "John Doe" and the preferred name was "John Smith" it appears as "John Doe" in the directory listing but "John Smith" in the expanded view........shouldn't it be the same in either view (namely the "Preferred" name?

Concern has been expressed to me that members full names are shown in the online directory, and not the preferred name.

This has two aspects:
1. the full name is the complete name with middle names too. This is often considered too personal to show the middle names
2. the preferred name is not shown, but is preferred!

because of this, members may prefer to not allow their entry to be shown in the ward directory

kirt1 wrote:Why doesn't the name in the Ward Directory listing match the name in the expanded view of the same person? For example, if the "official" name were "John Doe" and the preferred name was "John Smith" it appears as "John Doe" in the directory listing but "John Smith" in the expanded view........shouldn't it be the same in either view (namely the "Preferred" name?

I can't duplicate this. Are we talking about the new directory on the new LDS.org at http://lds.org/directory ? Because when I look at that directory, I see preferred names in the listing of households on the left, and when I click on a particular household, I see all the details for that household on the right. In that detail area, every single name is the preferred name (we have several households where the person goes by his or her middle name, so it's easy to tell).

However, your example was an unusual one, where the preferred name doesn't change the first name, but rather changes the last name. That's quite rare, and there is no one in our stake that does that, so I can't confirm whether or not the problem you are seeing is unique to a change in last name for the preferred name.

But in general, the directory does show the preferred name. And I checked the ward directory in the Classic Stake and Ward Websites, and it does the same.

aebrown wrote:However, your example was an unusual one, where the preferred name doesn't change the first name, but rather changes the last name. That's quite rare, and there is no one in our stake that does that, so I can't confirm whether or not the problem you are seeing is unique to a change in last name for the preferred name.

It's not so unusual if a woman marries or divorces, and either 1) the clerk (or the temple) posts the marriage or divorce, and changes the name on the record, but not the preferred name, or 2) the clerk doesn't post the marriage or divorce, but does change the preferred name.

jwtaber wrote:It's not so unusual if a woman marries or divorces, and either 1) the clerk (or the temple) posts the marriage or divorce, and changes the name on the record, but not the preferred name, or 2) the clerk doesn't post the marriage or divorce, but does change the preferred name.

Yeah. The fix (when a preferred name is set) is when such a name-change occurs in MLS to ask the clerk to review the preferred name as well.
When the change comes through to local MLS from an out-side update, the status-printout should suggest that the clerk review the preferred name (if one is set).

I'll be at church tonight and set preferred named for my family on MLS and see how it works out when the updates filter through.

jwtaber wrote:It's not so unusual if a woman marries or divorces, and either 1) the clerk (or the temple) posts the marriage or divorce, and changes the name on the record, but not the preferred name, or 2) the clerk doesn't post the marriage or divorce, but does change the preferred name.

I wasn't trying to argue that it couldn't happen -- obviously it can. I was just saying that it was rare and I had no way to test it in my stake. My testing of the originally reported problem failed to duplicate the reported issue, so I was wondering if it only happened if the last name was changed on the preferred name.

aebrown wrote:I wasn't trying to argue that it couldn't happen -- obviously it can. I was just saying that it was rare and I had no way to test it in my stake. My testing of the originally reported problem failed to duplicate the reported issue, so I was wondering if it only happened if the last name was changed on the preferred name.

I'm just saying that in my stake it's not nearly rare enough.

aebrown wrote:I wasn't trying to argue that it couldn't happen -- obviously it can. I was just saying that it was rare and I had no way to test it in my stake. My testing of the originally reported problem failed to duplicate the reported issue, so I was wondering if it only happened if the last name was changed on the preferred name.

I have a couple of these in our ward (separated sister whose legal name is still her married one, but prefers her maiden name). In the list on the left, she shows with her legal name. When I click on the listing, the name at the top of the detail is her legal last name, but under the "Head of Household" section it shows her preferred name.

Also, the listing on the left does not show her middle name (even though it is shown for other members when it is in their preferred name) though looking in the leader services I see her legal name includes both of her middle names.

It almost seems like it is taking preferred first name, and legal last name.

This is a divorce-remarriage situation. Because we don't have proof of remarriage, the official last name is say "Jones". However she wants to be called by her new married last name say "Smith". Because she is now married to a non-member, she appears, on the right side, as "head of household" with preferred last name of "Smith" while the listing on the left side still shows her "official" last name of "Jones". On the membership record it show the "official" name of "Mary Jones" and the preferred name of "Mary Smith"? Why doesn't the listing on the left side show her preferred last name of "Smith" to be consistant with the "Head of Household" listing on the right? Both listing last names should reflect the preferred name of "Smith"

I've altered the preferred name on our ward records in MLS last Friday and many send-receive have been done since then, but the full name still shows up in the online directory.

Many people in the ward will not enable their entry to be shown in the directory as long as this is the case.

samliddicott wrote:I've altered the preferred name on our ward records in MLS last Friday and many send-receive have been done since then, but the full name still shows up in the online directory.

Many people in the ward will not enable their entry to be shown in the directory as long as this is the case.

Are you talking about the last name issue mentioned earlier in this thread, or just a typical case of "William Eustace Johnson" having a preferred name of "Bill Johnson"? Although there seem to be some problems with changing the last name on the preferred name, the only issue I know of with the first/middle name changing is that there can be some delay in the MLS change propagating to the Directory website on lds.org. We have hundreds of members in our stake who have different preferred names from their full names, and the preferred names do show up correctly on the Directory.

I don't know exactly what delays are involved, but I would wait at least a couple more days before I would conclude that there is any problem with the change that you made propagating to the Directory site. And I can assure you that it is not a general problem -- preferred names do indeed appear on the new Directory.

samliddicott wrote:I've altered the preferred name on our ward records in MLS last Friday and many send-receive have been done since then, but the full name still shows up in the online directory.

I can't help but wonder if this is similar to the issue of incorrect/duplicate calling information showing up in CDOL. Even though it seems they should be unrelated I would be tempted to try the following to correct it.

1. Login to MLS 3.3 on your ward clerk's computer. If the version of MLS on your ward clerk's computer is anything less than MLS 3.3, then the rest of these steps won't change anything.
2. Make a backup the database so you have something to revert to if needed.
3. Print out a complete ward directory and include membership numbers on the printout to use as a hardcopy backup for step 7.
4. Print out a Callings by Organization report to use as a hardcopy backup for step 8.
5. Do a Request Unit Refresh Data... from within MLS, and then do a Send/Receive.
6. After the Send/Receive has completed, wait at least 15 minutes and then do another Send/Receive to retrieve the requested refresh. Refreshes overwrite ALL the calling and membership data in your local version of MLS with what is on file at Church headquarters.
7. Use the membership directory printed out in step 3 make any need corrections to names, addresses, or to request records that disappeared. (Including membership numbers when requesting records used to speed up the records request.)
8. Use the Callings by Organization report you printed out in step 4 to make any needed corrections.
9. Transmit any changes made in steps 7 & 8 by doing another Send/Receive.

Thank-you; I will try that - in fact Church HQ have proposed such a thing across the country UK I believe for this Sunday. Certainly other changes made last week such as records transferred out and addition of email addresses have shown through, but not name changes in the same household.

I'll let you know how it goes in a week.

samliddicott wrote:Thank-you; I will try that - in fact Church HQ have proposed such a thing across the country UK I believe for this Sunday. Certainly other changes made last week such as records transferred out and addition of email addresses have shown through, but not name changes in the same household.

As I understand it, the events in the UK next week are purely related to financial errors, introduced by MLS/server problems. Not any other problems.

jbh001 wrote:I can't help but wonder if this is similar to the issue of incorrect/duplicate calling information showing up in CDOL. Even though it seems they should be unrelated I would be tempted to try the following to correct it.

1. Login to MLS 3.3 on your ward clerk's computer. If the version of MLS on your ward clerk's computer is anything less than MLS 3.3, then the rest of these steps won't change anything.
2. Make a backup the database so you have something to revert to if needed.
3. Print out a complete ward directory and include membership numbers on the printout to use as a hardcopy backup for step 7.
4. Print out a Callings by Organization report to use as a hardcopy backup for step 8.
5. Do a Request Unit Refresh Data... from within MLS, and then do a Send/Receive.
6. After the Send/Receive has completed, wait at least 15 minutes and then do another Send/Receive to retrieve the requested refresh. Refreshes overwrite ALL the calling and membership data in your local version of MLS with what is on file at Church headquarters.
7. Use the membership directory printed out in step 3 make any need corrections to names, addresses, or to request records that disappeared. (Including membership numbers when requesting records used to speed up the records request.)
8. Use the Callings by Organization report you printed out in step 4 to make any needed corrections.
9. Transmit any changes made in steps 7 & 8 by doing another Send/Receive.

A week after the change was made, the lds.org directory still shows the full names, even for members who removed their middle name from preferred names.
After the refresh of unit data, the local MLS reported the correct preferred names with middle name removed.

I conclude that the directory does not show the preferred name.

samliddicott wrote:A week after the change was made, the lds.org directory still shows the full names, even for members who removed their middle name from preferred names.
After the refresh of unit data, the local MLS reported the correct preferred names with middle name removed.

I conclude that the directory does not show the preferred name.

Your conclusion may be valid for your unit, or perhaps for the UK, but is definitely not correct as a general statement. For my stake in the US, the directory shows the preferred name.

So the issue clearly has nothing to do with a fundamental capability of the directory. What then is the explanation for the difference? My initial thought is that it is a regional determination. The privacy settings are different in the EU: members are not shown in the directory until they opt in, whereas in the US and many other places, members are show in the directory unless they opt out. It's certainly conceivable that the directory is configured so that in the UK or EU, full names are shown, but in other countries the preferred name is shown. But that's just a theory.

If others from the US and from the UK would share how this aspect of the directory works for them, we could narrow down whether it is a setting unique to our units or our countries, or is controlled by some other factor.

The directory only shows full names in Sweden as well.
As you say this might be a EU thing due to the privacy policy.
Hopefully this can be found out and fixed. It's quite annoying.

aebrown wrote: If others from the US and from the UK would share how this aspect of the directory works for them, we could narrow down whether it is a setting unique to our units or our countries, or is controlled by some other factor.

It is showing preferred names for me in the US.

I think your correct. The directory takes the PREFERRED first name and the LEGAL last name...this needs to be changed to be consistant. In my opinion the directory should show the preferred first and last name.

aebrown wrote:So the issue clearly has nothing to do with a fundamental capability of the directory. What then is the explanation for the difference? My initial thought is that it is a regional determination.

My thoughts as well. I wonder if this could be a setting that is made by the area office for those outside the US and Canada.

Perhaps guidance needs sending to clerks in UK and Europe stating to NOT change the regular name fields in MLS, but to ONLY change the preferred name fields; and stating that preferred names will be supported in MLS.

Otherwise I can see that some clerks would change the official name for members in order to affect what is shown in the directory.

Why in the world must we go through the ward clerk to change our preferred names? It should be a simple click and edit to get rid of middle names or change Charles Edward to Chuck. I sort of understand the last name issue - prefer to have the official record changed to reflect the correct legal last name - but getting rid of middle names or changing to abbreviations should be permitted by individual members without requiring them to go through the ward clerk.

cewiseman wrote:Why in the world must we go through the ward clerk to change our preferred names?

Because the programming development of the new directory has not yet included the capability for the member to make that change on-line. Will it? We don't know.

cewiseman wrote:It should be a simple click and edit to get rid of middle names or change Charles Edward to Chuck. I sort of understand the last name issue - prefer to have the official record changed to reflect the correct legal last name - but getting rid of middle names or changing to abbreviations should be permitted by individual members without requiring them to go through the ward clerk.

I agree that a member should be able to use the technology available to input a requested change to their preferred name. But I do not agree a member should be able to make the change directly since it would be easy to violate Church standards when entering free text data. To maintain supervision of changes I think the member should be able to make a change much the same way a photo is added or changed for the new directory - the change is made to the on-line profile but must be approved by the clerk before the change is actually applied.

jdlessley wrote:Because the programming development of the new directory has not yet included the capability for the member to make that change on-line. Will it? We don't know.

Hope so. It was available in the Classic directory, so this technically is a step backward.

Of course, the display of the full name or the preferred name is so inconsistent at this point that it is hard to know which to use.

lajackson wrote:Hope so. It was available in the Classic directory, so this technically is a step backward.

It has been so long since I used the classic directory that I cannot remember what functions it had. I thought that for the classic directory only website administrators could make any changes to displayed names.

jdlessley wrote:It has been so long since I used the classic directory that I cannot remember what functions it had. I thought that for the classic directory only website administrators could make any changes to displayed names.

No, users could change their "first" names in their profiles.

We have had a few sisters in our ward who are divorced and want to use their maiden name as their last name. It was necessary to:
1. Change the preferred last name on the individual record in MLS
2. Change the household name on the household record in MLS
in order to get it to show up properly on the lds.org online directory. We never change the full legal name and it works great.

In order to be complete, they can also go to https://ldsaccount.lds.org/sign-in/go/p ... ummary.jsf and change their display name. This changes the way their name will be displayed in some applications (on lds.org?) though I'm not sure which. See http://tech.lds.org/wiki/LDS_Account.

We are also seeing the same thing - and the spanish and some german members have quite a few "middle" names.

The preferred name would be much better for the Online Directory.

The form of a members name should follow the wishes of the member (unless for some reason inappropriate). When we register for LDS Account we should be able to state our display/preferred name, which after review by the Ward Clerk for propriety, be used in the Directory for all purposes. There is no good reason to require the Clerk to enter the preferred name for every member. Following the procedure in Calendar, the member should be able to insert his/her display/preferred name, and after review, it will appear in Directory for all purposes. The Directory is for member and priesthood use and view. The official name in membership records does not need to be displayed for the purposes of the Directory.

raleighj wrote:The form of a members name should follow the wishes of the member (unless for some reason inappropriate). When we register for LDS Account we should be able to state our display/preferred name, which after review by the Ward Clerk for propriety, be used in the Directory for all purposes. There is no good reason to require the Clerk to enter the preferred name for every member. Following the procedure in Calendar, the member should be able to insert his/her display/preferred name, and after review, it will appear in Directory for all purposes. The Directory is for member and priesthood use and view. The official name in membership records does not need to be displayed for the purposes of the Directory.

Thanks for posting your suggestion. I personally like the idea, but I would note that what you suggest will require significant design and development work to implement. The capability for the ward clerk to enter the preferred name in MLS exists right now. So for now, there actually is a good reason to require the ward clerk to enter the preferred name -- it's the only way it can be done!

Perhaps someone on the development team will see your suggestion here, but I would recommend that you use the Submit Feedback link on LDS.org to submit your suggestion. That way it will get routed to the appropriate people.