multiple cameras and microphones

We are trying to put together our broadcast for stake conference in early September. I will probably have more questions, but I was wondering where place your microphones? Also what kind of microphone do you use? I was told our sound system doesn't have an audio output. Do use separate mics for the speaker and the choir? Also, we plan on using two of the song cameras. Can someone recommend an affordable video splitter. Also, can we view both cameras on the computer and switch between them. Is that part of the meetinghouse software or will I need to use a different software.

Sent from my HTC cell phone.

jviola wrote:I was told our sound system doesn't have an audio output.

You may want to scout around the pulpit and control area. It may actually have a output - it's just no one knows about it.

But you'll still need mics for the choir.

Can someone recommend a video/audio splitter for maybe 2 or 3 cameras and 1 or 2 microphones.

jviola wrote:We are trying to put together our broadcast for stake conference in early September. I will probably have more questions, but I was wondering where place your microphones? Also what kind of microphone do you use? I was told our sound system doesn't have an audio output. Do use separate mics for the speaker and the choir? ...

If there is no hardwired audio output from the PA system, one option would be to use the headphone output of a hearing-impaired receiver. The receivers are supposed to be kept in the library--at least at the last time I was instructed on the matter. The audio quality may not be superb, but it should be reasonably good. You'll want to watch the audio levels, because the hearing-impaired unit may clip harshly if it gets overdriven.

jviola wrote:Can someone recommend a video/audio splitter for maybe 2 or 3 cameras and 1 or 2 microphones.

Please do not split microphone signals (need to know what you are doing, and a failure such as a short would be devistating to a meeting). Find a line level audio feed from under the clerk's desk, next to the pulpit, from the hearing imaired receiver, etc.

Line level audio (headphone level) can be split with a 'Y' cable (Radio Shack)

Composite video (camera) can be split with a Video Distribution Amplifier (Radio Shack)

RF (television) can be split with an RF splitter (Radio Shack)

Cameras (video) can be properly switched with a Video Mixer but a video or game switch can do the job in a pinch (the video will be unstable when you switch feeds)

Hope this helps.

On page 7 of the Meetinghouse Webcast guide it say that there are 3 Video in composite. Plus, there is a S-Video in. Does that mean that I can setup 3 connections from 3 composite sources and 1 from S-Video and the communicator can handle all 4? Can you hook up and monitor on the DVI out connection and see the output? Can you hook up a USB keyboard and mouse on the communicator or is it setup only to run from the front menu?

If anyone can share more light on it I would appreciate it. Our Stake Conference is Sept 12th.

Does anyone know the answer to my question? We need to order items soon and I need to know if the webcast communicator can have more than one video source connected to it or do we need to purchase a video mixer?

thanks.

The following replies are from a contact I have that is familiar with the "inner workings" of the Webcast Communicator. I have no personal experience with the box myself.

jviola wrote:On page 7 of the Meetinghouse Webcast guide it say that there are 3 Video in composite. Plus, there is a S-Video in. Does that mean that I can setup 3 connections from 3 composite sources and 1 from S-Video and the communicator can handle all 4?

No - you can either use Composite 1 or S-Video as the Windows Media Encoder Software only allows one video source at a time. Some stakes have handled multiple cameras with an external switch with multiple inputs, and a single output going from the external video switch to the Webcast Communicator.

jviola wrote:Can you hook up and monitor on the DVI out connection and see the output?

No - the DVI out connection is only used to see the windows XPe Desktop like a regular computer monitor. That is why the "Test" mode is provided with a minimal encoding delay so you can see the output on a receiving computer.

jviola wrote:Can you hook up a USB keyboard and mouse on the communicator or is it setup only to run from the front menu?

You can hook up a keyboard, mouse, and monitor and you can see the Windows XPe Desktop and interact with it as you would any XP-based PC. There is a minimized program on the toolbar that is running the front panel and also provides error messages for troubleshooting. Keyboard, mouse, and monitor interaction is only needed for troubleshooting purposes. The Communicator was setup to run entirely from the front panel without keyboard, mouse, and monitor interaction at all.

Thank you very much for the clarification.

oregonmatt's answers are completely correct.

Dual cameras must be either mixed or switched before the signal enters the webcast communicator.

In our Stake Center broadcasts - we have two objectives. Distribute the camera signal through the building modulator to the ancilliary rooms around the Stake Center, and also get a clean signal into the communicator to be broadcast to our other three buildings.

We have two cameras - and send the signal into a video mixer where we can do our switching between the two views, and also add the hymn text for the outlying buildings.

You probably don't have time to put this type system in place before your September conference, but could maybe shoot for it for the next one.

Regarding audio - We leave the house audio as-is and don't modify it in any way so that it can be used in the Stake center the way it was intended. For our broadcast audio signal that goes to the webcast communicator, we have a completely separate audio system wired to an audio mixer where we mix the audio mic levels before broadcasting.

We have 5 mics (3 choir mics, one hanging in the sound chamber for the organ, and one on the sound board of the piano) for the pulpit mic audio, we split it under the pulpit into our own audio system. This way we can completely control the audio that gets broadcast.

We have one luxury that most do not, and that is that one of Bonneville Communication's elite Engineers is in our Stake and he has helped us develop this system.

I hope sharing some thoughts of our methods will help you in some way.

heyring,

Can you tell me what video mixer and audio mixer you have?

We (like most Stakes) don't have a very extravagant budget for these things, so after MUCH research we went with a fairly low cost video mixer.

http://www.ambery.com/auvimidiefpr.html

A lot of Stakes are using this one, and we took a chance on purchasing from E-Bay for $500. It does the trick after a bit of practice.

Just about any basic audio mixer will work. Something with the required number of inputs like:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Behringer+- ... &cp=1&lp=4

The Mackie 402-VLZ3 is another inexpensive ($130 USD) mixer that has been used on numerous occasions to webcast. More information here.

That is a great suggestion for an audio mixer. That's probably why it is in the Wiki

The goal is generally to receive XLR mic inputs, adjust the levels to the desired volume and send the audio over a compatible cable to the webcast encoder.

There are many mixers out there that will do the minimum, but most likely there will be additional cool things that will need to be mixed and adapted.

This will be THE key component, 2nd only to microphones that will determine the audio that goes to the outlying buildings.

So many decisions - so little time

I thought I'd add a few comments to address your original question.

First of all, just to clarify, you asked about video & audio splitters. But, I think you may actually be looking for a video switch or mixer, and an audio mixer. Responses above have addressed both cases, so I only mention this to avoid any confusion.

If you're splitting signals, as mentioned in earlier posts, be very careful since you can mess up the signals pretty easily if done incorrectly. If that indeed is what you need to do, let us know, and we can suggest some good techniques and equipment to do that. But I think most of us are assuming you're trying to switch multiple cameras and microphones into one output to feed the broadcast encoder.

To answer your original questions about microphones and placement, I have a few pieces of advice:

The most basic way to get the audio for your broadcast is to just take the line level output from the chapel audio system. The Crown pulpit mics in most buildings do an OK job of picking up ambient sound from the choir, organ, etc. If this is your first broadcast, it might be worth trying with just the chapel feed before making the audio system any more complicated. We have done several successful broadcasts this way over the years.

If your building does not have a line level output from the sound system, then you should get one installed, and a line run to the location of your broadcast encoder- talk to your FM group about having the audio contractor come out to do that. It is very simple job in most cases, but I don't recommend trying to hack into it yourself.

That said, you can get much better broadcast audio by adding a few microphones for the choir, piano/organ, and special musical numbers.

For best results, try to keep the audo system as simple as possible. More microphones is almost always NOT better. Don't add microphones to solve audio problems. Try to use a minimal amount of mics and experiment with the type of microphone and the placement to get the results you want.

For instance, the dynamic mics ("ice-cream cone" style) that you have in the library are TERRIBLE for choir mics. It's not a matter of quality, they're just the wrong kind of microphone and just don't work very well. A condenser mic is what is usually used here. Even a cheap inexpensive one will be 100 times better than using a dynamic mic. The right placement of the mic will solve 90% of the problems that come up.

It is advantageous to have separate microphones feeding the broadcast, separate from the chapel audio system. You don't want to plug extra microphones into the chapel sound system if you only need them to enhance the broadcast audio. That will often cause feedback or mix problems in the chapel.

We have had excellent results on our broadcasts by mixing our line level chapel audio output with two choir mics (condensers) high on each side of the choir at the front of the rostrum. These are not plugged into the chapel sound system, but go straight to our audio mixer. These pick up choir, organ, and piano very well. We've considered adding additional "close" mics for the organ, piano, etc. but once we found a good placement for the two choir mics, we haven't needed to do anything more. Sometimes we'll have one more if there is a special musical number that needs extra attention.

Anyway, that's my advice- start simple, then carefully add what you need in order to get the results you want.

Hope that helps.

I'd be interested in what kind of benefit condenser mic's hooked into the chapel system would provide? Have you tested that scenario?

I only have a couple more broadcasts from this building before I have a new stake center, so I don't want to invest too much. In my previous broadcast using the chapel system, I was stuck taking RF through a vcr to separate the component and composite signals, but the audio I still had to run through a line reducer. It worked for that broadcast, but the choir was totally absent as we only used the input from the chapel mic. I'm hoping to have a direct composite / component out of the satellite system instead of having to use the internal RF.. hopefully that will increase the quality and reduce the line levels a bit.

jshawut wrote:I'm hoping to have a direct composite / component out of the satellite system instead of having to use the internal RF.. hopefully that will increase the quality and reduce the line levels a bit.

I'm confused - are you saying you hope to get a composite out from AV Rack from the camera? Otherwise it seems you're talking about a "live" conference vs. one broadcast on the satellite system - apples and oranges.

Sorry about that...

The direct connection out of the satellite system meant to be (the satellite Rack - mounted in our media center) There is a single U (row) of that rack that contains 2 RF outputs, and a video and audio out (RCA type connections). Right now my RCA connections don't go anywhere which forces me to come out of the RF into a VCR. Our satellite rack has 2 channels defined, the internal video/chapel audio (chanel 12) and the church broadcast (chanel 3) - I want to get the Internal Camera and chapel sound - Chanel 12 audio and video setup as the output there.

jshawut wrote:Right now my RCA connections don't go anywhere

On our system, it's the output of the VCR.

Someone would have to install a small video/audio distribution amp to make them a chapel output. Right now I'll bet the incoming video and audio goes directly to the modulator so there's no spare connection.

jshawut wrote:I'd be interested in what kind of benefit condenser mic's hooked into the chapel system would provide? Have you tested that scenario?

I only have a couple more broadcasts from this building before I have a new stake center, so I don't want to invest too much. In my previous broadcast using the chapel system, I was stuck taking RF through a vcr to separate the component and composite signals, but the audio I still had to run through a line reducer. It worked for that broadcast, but the choir was totally absent as we only used the input from the chapel mic. I'm hoping to have a direct composite / component out of the satellite system instead of having to use the internal RF.. hopefully that will increase the quality and reduce the line levels a bit.

Yes, we have tested that scenario, and it was not good. Our condenser mics are pretty hot and have a wide cardioid sensitivity pattern, so just plugging them into the chapel system causes feedback problems and adds unwanted ambient noise to the chapel audio when the choir is not singing. The chapel system does not allow you to attenuate or mute the extra mic inputs, so you have to put them through a mixer or attenuator before plugging into the chapel system. We tried this, but we couldn't get enough gain before feeback to really help much, so the whole process just wasn't worth it in our case.

However, in our building, the acoustics are OK and we have never had any complaints that the choir was too soft or didn't sound good. We only wanted the extra sound reinforcement for our broadcast audio. The existing chapel system works fine for the local congregation. This was why I suggested that it is best to treat your local and broadcast audio systems separately.

But every case is different, so if you want or need to add some sound reinforcement in the local audio system, then you would need some XLR splitters. (you have to get a special device to do this, they're about $30-$40 ea). You would split the choir mics two ways: One way into a local mixer or attenuator so you could adjust the gain and mute where appropriate so it sounded good in the chapel. The other way would go to your mixer that feeds your broadcast encoder.

But that's more complexity than I prefer in this kind of broadcast unless you really need it. If I could design my own system here's what I'd do- I'd get the audio contractor to come out and add a separate audio input (for choir or general sound reinforcement) to the mixer. The mixer would be programmed so the new input would not be mixed into the chapel feed, but would be mixed into the cultural hall, overflow speakers, RF Modulators, and broadcast line-out. This way you could add sound reinforcment for all of the areas that don't get all of the acoustic volume in the chapel, without making it too loud up close to the choir where the ambient volume is normally just fine, and you would avoid feedback problems.

But, I haven't really had the opportunity to pitch this idea yet. We are also getting a new stake center soon, so I may see if we can try something like that with the new system. But I'm discouraged that the system they're installing is still the same old circa-1980 modulator-based system that isn't very friendly to our broadcasts and multimedia presentations. But that's another topic entirely. I've been meaning to start a new thread to vent about this, so watch for that sometime soon...

Anyway, I hope that helps,

SBankhead wrote:so if you want or need to add some sound reinforcement in the local audio system, then you would need some XLR splitters. (you have to get a special device to do this, they're about $30-$40 ea). You would split the choir mics two ways: One way into a local mixer or attenuator so you could adjust the gain and mute where appropriate so it sounded good in the chapel. The other way would go to your mixer that feeds your broadcast encoder.

Well, that's one way. If you have a mixer with more than one ouput, (such as a monitor feed or auxiliary send) you can "split" at the mixer. The advantage of that is one control can mute the mics for both feeds.

I'd get the audio contractor to come out and add a separate audio input (for choir or general sound reinforcement) to the mixer. The mixer would be programmed so the new input would not be mixed into the chapel feed, but would be mixed into the cultural hall, overflow speakers, RF Modulators, and broadcast line-out. This way you could add sound reinforcment for all of the areas that don't get all of the acoustic volume in the chapel, without making it too loud up close to the choir where the ambient volume is normally just fine, and you would avoid feedback problems.

But, I haven't really had the opportunity to pitch this idea yet.

That's how ours is setup. We have an auxiliary in that feeds all but the front speakers.

RussellHltn wrote:Well, that's one way. If you have a mixer with more than one ouput, (such as a monitor feed or auxiliary send) you can "split" at the mixer. The advantage of that is one control can mute the mics for both feeds.

Very true. I was just thinking of my setup where I need to be mixing in a different location, so 2 mixers work better. But you're right- there's no reason why you couldn't do it all on one mixer. My real point was that you'll often need separate level control of each feed, so on a single mixer you may need to use a monitor channel, or just left-right channels to control levels for each feed separately.

That's how ours is setup. We have an auxiliary in that feeds all but the front speakers.

That's very interesting and encouraging, and here I was thinking I had an original idea... I've never seen this in a church installation, but it makes a lot of sense. I'm curious, do you know if your stake had that auxiliary input added as a special request, or has it just always been there?

Where is the input located? Up on the rostrum or back by the amp racks?

I'm a little paranoid since our FM group is very resistant to letting us install anything "non-standard". But if it has been done elsewhere, I might have a good case to make.

SBankhead wrote:I'm curious, do you know if your stake had that auxiliary input added as a special request, or has it just always been there?

Where is the input located? Up on the rostrum or back by the amp racks?

Special Request. It has it's own cable that plugs into the wall. The same cable (a short snake) also carries the 3 built in choir mics and the 4 connectors we have near the podium.

This was all designed by the church audio department and installed by the usual church contractor.

I should add that our stake center is a Tabernacle complete with 100-seat choir loft. We hold large Christmas concerts. So our situation is a bit non-standard.

The main thing is to get your stake president behind you and have him work with the FM Group to get what you need.

I thought this thread had died. I would of participated more had I known it was still going on.

Our Stake Conference is this coming weekend and we are still putting things together........We hope the last few parts arrive today or tomorrow. We are cutting this so close. It is our very first attempt so I hope it isn't a complete disaster.

We have a General Authority visiting this time. This is actually good. Because he wants all young people in the stake 14 - 19 years of age to come to the stake center Sunday morning before stake conference so he can talk to them. This will greatly reduce the number of people left in the building that we will broadcast to. I guess I'm thinking possibly less damage.

After this weekend I will write up a report of how things went.

Just a thought about capturing audio from the Organ.

Many buildings have electronic organs that have audio output jacks underneath the keyboard.

We send the output of the organ to the mixer that is used to mix/broadcast the sound to the other buildings.

A real benefit is clean prelude organ music before meetings start.

Well, we had success in our first attempt, but we learned a lot and want to improve on it.

I'd like to write up what we did with some photo, equipment and connectors listed, but I don't know if it is best to put it here or start a new thread.

jviola wrote:I'd like to write up what we did with some photo, equipment and connectors listed, but I don't know if it is best to put it here or start a new thread.

I'd recommend that you start a new thread, since this thread deals with particular issues. In the new thread, you can reference this thread by saying something like: "A couple of the issues we encountered are discussed in the multiple cameras and microphones thread."

With choir mic's we get alot of feedback, the issue being overhead speakers. is there a way to install a switch to disconnect those speakers over the stand. I do like the idea of adding an additional input. I also think that adding a few mic inputs on the floor of the stand would be great if there was access below the stand.

normandeb wrote:With choir mic's we get alot of feedback, the issue being overhead speakers. is there a way to install a switch to disconnect those speakers over the stand. I do like the idea of adding an additional input.

Go though your stake presidency to the FM group to see if you can get what you need. I think the standard equipment that's used has 4 mic inputs. So there may be two inputs available. When they installed our system, those inputs where wired to where you could plug in a mic on the floor.

We have a customized sound system. They provided a line input into the distribution device. As a result, my line input goes to all speakers except the choir speakers. You probably don't want to turn off the choir speakers completely - that would leave the choir unable to hear the talks. (Been there, done that, got the complaints.)

I would highly advise against modifying the system on your own. That's why I say work though the stake with the FM group to get what you need.

heyring wrote:Just about any basic audio mixer will work. Something with the required number of inputs like:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Behringer+- ... &cp=1&lp=4

It's noteworthy to mention that most pulpit microphones need power, so if you're planning on running the podium microphone into a mixer (not splitting the feed), make sure the mixer has the "Phantom Power" option. Otherwise, the pulpit microphone will not work.

Many upgraded mixers have a Phantom Power switch on them that allows you to do this.

Also, it is best to purchase a mixer with "balanced" XLR inputs, not just XLR jacks. Some cheap mixers only have or unbalanced XLR input jacks (or just 1/4" unbalanced jacks).

Most high quality microphones are balanced, so purchasing a mixer with balanced XLR inputs will match the type of connection and impedance without requiring adapters.

RussellHltn wrote:Go though your stake presidency to the FM group to see if you can get what you need. I think the standard equipment that's used has 4 mic inputs. So there may be two inputs available. When they installed our system, those inputs where wired to where you could plug in a mic on the floor.
We have a customized sound system. They provided a line input into the distribution device. As a result, my line input goes to all speakers except the choir speakers. You probably don't want to turn off the choir speakers completely - that would leave the choir unable to hear the talks. (Been there, done that, got the complaints.)
I would highly advise against modifying the system on your own. That's why I say work though the stake with the FM group to get what you need.

Could I get some more details on how this was done? We are looking to do the same thing and it would be nice to be able to tell FM that it has been done before and how it was done.

Aaron Z

Aczlan wrote:Could I get some more details on how this was done? We are looking to do the same thing and it would be nice to be able to tell FM that it has been done before and how it was done.

I wasn't involved in the details, but as far as I know:the stake presidency wanted it. We went though he FM group and it went to the church department that handles the sound system design, setup and tuning. It might be easier to stick to the specs of what you want and what problem it solves (in case the designer has an idea that might accomplish the same thing).

I know our line in is unusual, but I thought the two mic jacks were standard setup.

RussellHltn wrote:I wasn't involved in the details, but as far as I know:the stake presidency wanted it. We went though he FM group and it went to the church department that handles the sound system design, setup and tuning. It might be easier to stick to the specs of what you want and what problem it solves (in case the designer has an idea that might accomplish the same thing).
I know our line in is unusual, but I thought the two mic jacks were standard setup.

So, you have an input that feeds into the whole system and one that excludes the speakers above the rostrum?
We currently have 5 mic level input jacks (2 in front of the rostrum, 1 under the podium and 2 under the sacrament table) and 2 line level input jacks (one under the sacrament table and one non-functional jack in the Stake Clerk's office), but they all feed into the whole system.
We came up with a way to shut off the speakers over the rostrum with a relay when needed, but if there is something that has been done elsewhere I think that FM would prefer it.
Our system is in need of being re-balanced (the gym sound levels are noticeably lower than the chapel sound levels when the partitions are open) and while they are out doing that, having that added would be nice.

Thanks

Aaron Z

Aczlan wrote:So, you have an input that feeds into the whole system and one that excludes the speakers above the rostrum?

Yes. The way our system was designed, there's a DSP device between the mixer and the power amps. In addition to the equalization, it also acts as a programmable audio distribution box. (It used to be a Crown, but it was replaced, I don't remember the brand that's in there now.) For example, it's the box that switches the chapel audio into the gym when the doors are opened. We were given our own XLR (balanced) line-level input into that box and the programming is such that our audio is fed everywhere (regardless of the position of the doors) except for the amp that feeds the choir speakers.

Aczlan wrote:We currently have 5 mic level input jacks (2 in front of the rostrum, 1 under the podium and 2 under the sacrament table)

Interesting. In addition to the podium and sacrament table mic, we have 4 mic jacks, but they feed two inputs on the mixer - in effect the building wiring forms a "Y" cable. You can either use the two mics in the choir loft or the two on the sides of the stand. But if you try to use both at the same time you may find the performance isn't what you'd expect since the jacks are "Y" together. IIRC, the automatic mic mixer they used only has 4 inputs, so you might check as see if any of your jacks are "Y"ed.

Aczlan wrote:Our system is in need of being re-balanced (the gym sound levels are noticeably lower than the chapel sound levels when the partitions are open) and while they are out doing that, having that added would be nice.

It would be good to make a list. The FM group in my area has to fly out someone for the setup. Needless to say, the FM group batches all the audio work in the area to make the best use of the tech's time.

While you're thinking of things to add, we've also got 3 hanging choir mics and a 4 channel snake built into the building. It does simplify setup.

However, our stake center is decidedly non-standard. Most stake centers don't have a 100 seat choir loft, much less a 10+ year tradition of grand Christmas Concerts.

RussellHltn wrote:While you're thinking of things to add, we've also got 3 hanging choir mics and a 4 channel snake built into the building. It does simplify setup.
However, our stake center is decidedly non-standard. Most stake centers don't have a 100 seat choir loft, much less a 10+ year tradition of grand Christmas Concerts.

We thought about those, but decided that we dont need the built in mics or a built in snake.
We have 3 chior mics that mount on mic stands which work great stake conference, or the Sundays in July when we have ~1000 people in for Sacrament Meeting (visitors for the Hill Cumorah Pageant).
We looked at a built in snake too, but opted to spec a 100' portable snake snake and pass throughs to the stake clerks office as the snake could then be used for roadshows and it is cheaper.


Aaron Z

Aczlan wrote:We thought about those, but decided that we dont need the built in mics or a built in snake.
We have 3 chior mics that mount on mic stands which work great stake conference, or the Sundays in July when we have ~1000 people in for Sacrament Meeting (visitors for the Hill Cumorah Pageant).
We looked at a built in snake too, but opted to spec a 100' portable snake snake and pass throughs to the stake clerks office as the snake could then be used for roadshows and it is cheaper.


Aaron Z

I spoke with my Audio technician. He said that all I really need to mic my choir for stake conference is two good uni directional microphones going into a mixer and then the output of the mixer into one of the microphone jacks. The only drawback to that is that you need someone to run the mixer.

In my area my audio technician has the buildings sound perfect. He doesn't like the hanging microphones.

So got a lot of testing before my stake conference in June.

We installed 2 hanging choir mics (Shure MX202W/C). They are white so they match the wall of the chapel and hang from the ceiling all the time because are very unobtrusive. The choir mics feed a mixer which provides phantom power for the choir mics and lets us set the level the way we want them. The mixer was a castoff from the upgrade of another building and is mounted in the audio rack.

We also cut the satellite feed line and put a set of mating male/female XLR connectors in the line (we actually didn’t cut the wire, but that’s the best way to describe the signal flow). This is on the line that feeds satellite sound into the building mixer. For stake conference we separate the two XLR connectors and plug the choir mic mixer output into where the satellite feed would normally enter the building audio system mixer.

During choir numbers (and hymns, since the same mics pick up the organ and piano well) the satellite sound is turned on with the podium switch (which can also adujst the choir volume), and for the rest of the conference it is turned off. After conference we move the connector back to the satellite feed.

We have used this setup for several years without any problems.

I found a document from Shure “Audio Systems Guide for Houses of Worship” pages 42 & 43 very helpful in placing the choir microphones. It is easy to find as a PDF document online, and I would recommend it for anyone tackling the audio topics in this thread. To be clear, I’m not endorsing Shure – several other vendors make similar hanging choir mics.

This work was done with the approval of the FM group, and I echo the caution others have mentioned about disturbing the sound system without the FM group being in the loop – the systems are carefully engineered and calibrated for the building.

rknelson wrote: We also cut the satellite feed line and put a set of mating male/female XLR connectors in the line (we actually didn’t cut the wire, but that’s the best way to describe the signal flow). This is on the line that feeds satellite sound into the building mixer. For stake conference we separate the two XLR connectors and plug the choir mic mixer output into where the satellite feed would normally enter the building audio system mixer.

Where did you tie into that? Was that in the amp rack?

I found a document from Shure “Audio Systems Guide for Houses of Worship” pages 42 & 43 very helpful in placing the choir microphones. It is easy to find as a PDF document online, and I would recommend it for anyone tackling the audio topics in this thread. To be clear, I’m not endorsing Shure – several other vendors make similar hanging choir mics.

I have printed a copy of that document and their "Microphone Techniques for Live Sound Reinforcement" to use as reference materials when I am unsure how to mic something. I have found them to be well written and very helpful. They are not as entertaining to read as the Mackie manuals, but they have good information.

This work was done with the approval of the FM group, and I echo the caution others have mentioned about disturbing the sound system without the FM group being in the loop – the systems are carefully engineered and calibrated for the building.

That is the key IMO. FM needs to know (and approve of) what is happening, or 2 years down the road your system might disappear 2 days before Stake Conference when the sound company comes through to replace a bad mixer and FM doesn't know why there is an extra mixer in the amp rack, so it gets removed.

Aaron Z

Aczlan wrote:That is the key IMO. FM needs to know (and approve of) what is happening, or 2 years down the road your system might disappear 2 days before Stake Conference when the sound company comes through to replace a bad mixer and FM doesn't know why there is an extra mixer in the amp rack, so it gets removed.

I don't disagree, but I'd rather not rely on the memory of the FM guy. I'd suggest labeling the mixer. You might also want to consider a switch. That way the mixer will have a "connection". As it stands now, someone looking at it may conclude it's no longer in use since the output isn't connected to anything.

RussellHltn wrote:I don't disagree, but I'd rather not rely on the memory of the FM guy. I'd suggest labeling the mixer. You might also want to consider a switch. That way the mixer will have a "connection". As it stands now, someone looking at it may conclude it's no longer in use since the output isn't connected to anything.

Good point. Something that is connected, has a label that says "Chior Mic Mixer" and has documentation as to what it does will be less likely to be removed than an unlabeled mixer with no output connections.

Aaron Z