StickyDiminished support for Android 4.x (and prior)

I've been given a heads up that LDS Tools on Android 4.x (and before) is likely to end at some point in the future. The issue is getting the security protocol TLS 1.2 to work in Android 4. Things change and there's a need to get off the prior versions of TLS.

The church is aware of the number of people with Android 4 devices, but with the trade-off between them and security, security won.

Currently, 4.4 is stuck on LDS Tools 3.4.1 and can't upgrade to 3.5. But given that this is a security issue, 3.4.1 might be cut off completely at some time in the future.

If you have an older device, it's time to keep an eye on the specials and get a phone with a newer OS that's still receiving patches. Not only for church security, but to have a more secure device - especially if you do any financial transactions on it.

Good post. More information here: https://tech.lds.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=32020

While in the LDS Tools calendar I Refreshed it and the calendar went blank and would not display again. When I tried to sync I was kicked out. I thought I'd unstall LDS Tools and reinstall it but soon found I cound not install it again. I got a message saying my device was to old. I am shocked the church, of all people would force it's members to spend hundreds of dollars to utilize their tools. I'm on an Android 4.4.4 device, but I would hope the church would have their technical people find a way to update the security for older devices instead forcing us to buy new when everything else on the device works fine. There doesn't seem to even be a way to install the older version of LDS Tools, so I'm just out of luck. Not happy, that's for sure, very disappointed.

nhbass wrote:While in the LDS Tools calendar I Refreshed it and the calendar went blank and would not display again. When I tried to sync I was kicked out. I thought I'd unstall LDS Tools and reinstall it but soon found I cound not install it again. I got a message saying my device was to old. I am shocked the church, of all people would force it's members to spend hundreds of dollars to utilize their tools. I'm on an Android 4.4.4 device, but I would hope the church would have their technical people find a way to update the security for older devices instead forcing us to buy new when everything else on the device works fine. There doesn't seem to even be a way to install the older version of LDS Tools, so I'm just out of luck. Not happy, that's for sure, very disappointed.

It isn't the church. Android (and Apple) could provide security patches for obsolete versions of their software, but they choose to not do that. However, running LDSTools on an OS with known security issues puts everyone in your ward at risk of a data breach through your device (depending on your calling). I don't have any special insight as I'm just a ward clerk in Oklahoma, but in reading many of the posts in the forums, it is clear that the church has taken the stand that security of private membership data is more important than individual user convenience. And owning a digital device is not required to fulfill any calling in the church (in my opinion).

I own an older tablet that has also lost access to LDSTools, though I still can use LCR via the web browser if I want to. A bit inconvenient? yes. Am I unhappy at the church over it? no. If I feel strongly enough about it, I can purchase a newer device. For now, I'll live with what I have.

Absolutely correct, Brother Dave. It is the nature of technology and the free market that older devices become unsupported after several years. It is simply not cost effective for any technology company to continue to support legacy software and hardware forever. You really can't use Windows XP or any older version of Windows these days, and even Windows 7 will become unsupported in 2020. If your home router is no longer supported with fresh firmware updates from the OEM, then you should replace it, even if it appears to work normally. The same principle applies to all mobile devices, which should be replaced when they become unsupported by their OEMs.

Computer security is extremely important to the Church. We should not expect the Church to continue to support obsolete and unsecure software and hardware versions. Cyber Monday is coming. New technology is becoming cheaper every year. Write your letter to Santa.

Oh, and when you do recycle your computers and mobile devices, please make sure you properly wipe all data from them.

drepouille wrote:It is the nature of technology and the free market that older devices become unsupported after several years.

The lifespan of PCs is somewhere around 5 years (at least that's how often the church changes them out). But for mobile devices, it appears to be around 3 years. You can hold out for a bit longer, but not by much.

russellhltn wrote:But for mobile devices, it appears to be around 3 years. You can hold out for a bit longer, but not by much.

Exactly why I refuse to pay "hundreds of dollars" for any mobile device. They are disposable technology. A $1000 phone is insanity.

russellhltn wrote:

drepouille wrote:It is the nature of technology and the free market that older devices become unsupported after several years.

The lifespan of PCs is somewhere around 5 years (at least that's how often the church changes them out). But for mobile devices, it appears to be around 3 years. You can hold out for a bit longer, but not by much.

Android 4.4 was first released 5 years ago (devices that support Android 4.4 or later go back 6 years). Android 5 (which is still supported by all of the Church's apps) came out about 4 years ago (devices that support Android 5 or later go back 5 years).

I feel for the original poster, though. Some warning would have eased the transition a lot. Instead, people found the app to suddenly not work, with no explanation. People have spent many fruitless hours trying to troubleshoot what seemed to them to be a problem with their device, only to find out that the actual problem was that the Church had withdrawn support for their app on their device. All those hours they spent trying to fix the problem were wasted. That can lead to a lot of frustration. Moreover, there are people who use their Kindle Fires primarily for the Church apps, and for some of them, $50 is a lot of money. If they had just bought one of those things, they must have felt burned.

Davesudweeks's suggestion is a good one. Use an Internet browser on the old device to log into lds.org, and get the same information that way. Won't help much when you're not connected to WiFi, but that's life.

drepouille's point is also well-taken. Paying a lot for a device that won't be supported with security updates in just a few years can be a real problem. It's definitely something to keep in mind when shopping for a device.

ulupoi, I feel for the original poster as well - I am in the same boat as one who lost access on my Android 4.4 device after the fact. However, I have read that the group supporting these apps is very small and I suspect they are likely overwhelmed by the workload and just don't have the ability to provide updates on status.

Often, things like training materials and communication are the last things to be worked on. But, it is what it is and I appreciate their efforts. I hope the Lord will be as patient with me as I am trying to be with the programmers who I am sure are doing their very best given the requirements they are tasked to meet.

russellhltn wrote:I've been given a heads up that LDS Tools on Android 4.x (and before) is likely to end at some point in the future.

How did you get the heads up about the change?

I agree with the post by @davesudweeks -- Some advance notice of what will change and why, especially when devices will become unsupported, will be very helpful.
My wife just found out last week that she could no longer sync, and has one login left. Knowing what, when and why 3 months ago would have saved a lot of frustration and troubleshooting time.
And while it's not essential for her calling, she has come to rely on LDS tools. It makes her calling easier and less time consuming, and the website can't do what the app does.

supermyers wrote:How did you get the heads up about the change?

From one of our friendly employees who drop by the the forum.

But even then, that was pretty much after-the-fact information. That was before we discovered that older versions of LDS Tools gets unhappy with the disappearance of the old HT/VT servers (which was filling in for Ministering). Before that, I think the expectation was "diminished functionality". Not an abrupt end.

On the bright side, the season for deals is upon us. One does not need a "flagship" level device. The current crop of moderate priced devices are quite capable. Just make sure it's on a reasonable current version of Android and will get at least security updates for while longer. That last one can be tricky. You may want to look at new low-end models rather than close-outs.

I have verified that if I don’t use Crosswalk on Android 4.4.2 (KitKat), the native WebView cannot load and initialize Onsen properly.

I understand that Google has decided to support 4.4.4, which is how Onsen has similarly chosen to follow. Just that in reality, people are not replacing their phones fast enough if they do not break, and it would be a shame to forgo this user base, which can go up to almost 20%. Recent Cordova for Android has set its lowest version to Android API level 16, which corresponds to Android 4.1 (Jellybean).

If anyone finds comes across this thread, go to this thread, instead, for more information: viewtopic.php?f=103&t=34111

ulupoi wrote:If anyone finds comes across this thread, go to this thread, instead, for more information:

You posted a link for iOS Gospel Library in a Android Member Tools thread.

russellhltn wrote:

ulupoi wrote:If anyone finds comes across this thread, go to this thread, instead, for more information:

You posted a link for iOS Gospel Library in a Android Member Tools thread.

I know. There is a lot of information there that applies to both.

I thought that the manufacturer support lifespan for Apple products was short, but then I saw the numbers for Android devices. Good grief.

I have an LG-M153 (182)10 android phone. Information on the phone says the operating system is Android 6.0.1 Software is up to date I don't know what this all means, but from previous conversations on the forum, I understand that LDS tools will no longer run on Android 4.x. Should it run on Android 6.0.1 as I have? It stopped working about two weeks ago.

mommawheelz wrote:I have an LG-M153 (182)10 android phone. Information on the phone says the operating system is Android 6.0.1 Software is up to date I don't know what this all means, but from previous conversations on the forum, I understand that LDS tools will no longer run on Android 4.x. Should it run on Android 6.0.1 as I have? It stopped working about two weeks ago.

Yes, it should work - provided you have a current version of Member Tools. (if it's still called LDS Tools, it's not current).