Donation Records and History under One Name

Can someone confirm the following behavior of the new online donation system. I believe this is consistent with church practice for some time now, but since receipts were all on paper it may not have been apparent.
1. Donations will only be recorded by the church and reported to government authorities under one name. Specifically, a couple cannot make donations as a couple but must do so as one or the other individuals, or split the donation and do part under each individual. I believe this has been the case for many years now but it would not have been apparent to some people because of the way the receipts are commonly printed.
2. Donation records are only accessible to the person who made the donation. Specifically, one spouse cannot see what the other spouse has donated so, for example, if one spouse traditionally makes the donations for both, only that person will be able to see the records of the donations.
3. Printed receipts can (at the user option) include the name of both spouses on them.
If this is correct, some consideration might be given for how the money manager in a home might be able to submit donations under either name so the donations and the income on which they might be based are both under the correct name. The best method for this now appears to be having spouses share their login credentials, which is problematic if one of them has access by virtue of a calling to confidential materials or materials not generally available to members.

LarryBaxter wrote:Can someone confirm the following behavior of the new online donation system. I believe this is consistent with church practice for some time now, but since receipts were all on paper it may not have been apparent.

This has been true for several years now.

LarryBaxter wrote:1. Donations will only be recorded by the church and reported to government authorities under one name. Specifically, a couple cannot make donations as a couple but must do so as one or the other individuals, or split the donation and do part under each individual.

Correct, except that the Church does not report donations to government authorities. The member does that, normally because it is advantageous to their tax circumstances.

LarryBaxter wrote:2. Donation records are only accessible to the person who made the donation. Specifically, one spouse cannot see what the other spouse has donated so, for example, if one spouse traditionally makes the donations for both, only that person will be able to see the records of the donations.

This is correct.

LarryBaxter wrote:3. Printed receipts can (at the user option) include the name of both spouses on them.

This is also correct. This facilitates a couple using the receipt in filing a joint U.S. tax return, for example.

LarryBaxter wrote:If this is correct, some consideration might be given for how the money manager in a home might be able to submit donations under either name so the donations and the income on which they might be based are both under the correct name.

Any donation is tied to one membership record number, so this would not be possible under the current Church financial system. I can see here, however, that there may be quite a valid case for the ability of a spouse to donate to the "account of record" for them both, and for the other spouse to be able to see those contributions.

A spouse who normally handles the contributions may be temporarily away, and the other spouse desires to make the contribution for them both. A cleaner record would have one spouse being able to donate in the name of either, so that there is one record at the end of the year that represents them both. Otherwise, the couple has to round up two sets of donation records for the year for tax and other purposes.

This would be an excellent suggestion to provide at the Feedback links at the LDS.org site.

LarryBaxter wrote:The best method for this now appears to be having spouses share their login credentials, which is problematic if one of them has access by virtue of a calling to confidential materials or materials not generally available to members.

Sharing of login credentials should never happen, of course. A better approach would be for the spouses to share the donation information another way.

The spouse who makes the donation (even if it is intended for them both) is able to print a year to date report at any time. (Or one could login in and show the information onscreen to the other. Or a pdf could easily be created.) And as already mentioned, the annual statement for tax purposes is able to reflect both names. This was one of the very first changes made when financial contributions were tied to membership record numbers several years ago.

That said, I think I can see a good case for the need for access if one spouse makes the contribution and the other spouse prepares the tax return. And there may be other circumstances, as well. But under the present system, it appears they will just have to work together to gather the information when it is needed.

Suppose I were not doing donations online but, instead, was dealing with the Ward Clerk (and/or Assistant Ward Clerk-Finances) and I said, "Hey, could I have my wife's print-out because, you know, we both donate under her name?" Is it technically appropriate for the clerk to hand over that print-out to an adult other than the person whose name is on the print-out? (Suppose I never told the clerk whether or not to check that box which says to include the spouse's name on the print-out.) I guess what I'm asking is whether restricting a spouse from accessing the other's donation information is actually different online from what it is at the clerk's office?

gregwanderson wrote:I guess what I'm asking is whether restricting a spouse from accessing the other's donation information is actually different online from what it is at the clerk's office?

Yes, there is a difference. A clerk is more likely to know what's going on with the couple. When a couple divorces, there's frequently a significant period of time when one should NOT have access to the other's information before the divorce becomes final and the marriage is removed from the records. That said, I'm not sure as it's entirely appropriate for the clerk to give out the information unless he knows that they have been donating as a couple.

I suppose if the church was motivated to make it happen, there would be a checkbox on the account that says "allow my spouse access". But I'm really not sure as there's a solid reason for doing so. I've seen the desire, but I'm not seeing a solid case for a need. The rare exception (such as death or deployment of a spouse) can be handled by going to the clerks' office. I don't think there's any problem with having it under two different names if they are filing a joint tax return (at least in the US).

I dug back into the messages and found this one that indicate that the feature that allowed MLS to have both names on the tax statement was removed for 2014. So at this point, MLS can't be set up to do joint donation or even joint print-outs. So I wouldn't get my hopes up for having any such feature show up on-line.

The letter informing us of the online donations option was read yesterday. My husband and I do a join offering once a month. I use both of our names on the form that I fill out. However, we have different lds.org accounts, and my information does not show up in my account, and only in his account. I know that I can just submit under his, but wondered if there is a way to tie those two accounts together for this purpose. Thank you

elin wrote:wondered if there is a way to tie those two accounts together for this purpose.

No.

elin wrote:I use both of our names on the form that I fill out.

And if you look over the paperwork that the clerk gave you for 2014, you'll see just one name on it. Clerks were not able to combine names like they could before.

This will take some adjusting for many of us who want the online system to help us as much as the friendly, neighborhood ward clerk will help us. Since the ward clerk knows you he's likely to print a report for whatever member of your family you want. But the online system won't do that. So you can either A) keep asking the clerk for the reports you want or B) coordinate with your spouse to get the report you want and/or C) make all of your donations under one name (such as the name of the person in the home who is most helpful at providing reports when the others want them).

In summary: Once the members realize what the online system will and won't do, they can change their behavior accordingly (and then, who wants to bet that after we all learn to do things a certain way the programmers will change it so it will do what we wanted it to do before we made the adjustment? I, of course, will not take that bet).

gregwanderson wrote:...you can either A) keep asking the clerk for the reports you want or B) coordinate with your spouse to get the report you want and/or C) make all of your donations under one name (such as the name of the person in the home who is most helpful at providing reports when the others want them).

Option C is pretty easy (although I can certainly imagine some scenarios where it is not desirable), but in every case option B is extremely easy. Frankly, I'm having a hard time seeing how this is much of an issue at all, except for the fact that some people have a hard time with change. That seems particularly odd in this case, since the only people are affected are those who are embracing the change of using the online donations system.

aebrown wrote:Frankly, I'm having a hard time seeing how this is much of an issue at all, except for the fact that some people have a hard time with change. That seems particularly odd in this case, since the only people are affected are those who are embracing the change of using the online donations system.

Agreed. And I want to keep showing respect for the clerks. Now, whenever I donate online, I have the specific thought that "When I do this online, it means that two guys can go home from church one minute earlier on Sunday. And if 60 ward members do this then..." And when I figure out how to manage the reports on my own I save them that trouble too.

aebrown wrote:I'm having a hard time seeing how this is much of an issue at all, except for the fact that some people have a hard time with change.

I see two issues. One, in the past, some women, particularly stay-at-home moms weren't happy that there was no paper showing their name on the tithing reports. They wanted the paper to reflect their financial partnership and not just name one individual.

The second possibility is that they want more "openness" in their financial dealings. They may have joint banking accounts, maybe even joint email accounts. If only one can access the information, then it becomes like a "secret" and doesn't feel right to them.

I understand the desire, some rooted in emotional considerations, but I'm not sure as there is an answer. I think this is beyond developer discretion - it would have to be directed/approved by the Brethren. Perhaps the women should write to the General Relief Society Presidency to persuade the Brethren.

russellhltn wrote:And if you look over the paperwork that the clerk gave you for 2014, you'll see just one name on it. Clerks were not able to combine names like they could before.

That's not true. Because we moved last year we received two tax statements for 2014, one from our current ward and one generated by CHQ. Both statements had both my and my wife's names.

russellhltn wrote:

aebrown wrote:I'm having a hard time seeing how this is much of an issue at all, except for the fact that some people have a hard time with change.

I see two issues. One, in the past, women, particularly stay-at-home moms weren't happy that there was no paper showing their name on the tithing reports. They wanted the paper to reflect their financial partnership and not just name one individual.

The second possibility is that they want more "openness" in their financial dealings. They probably have joint banking accounts, maybe even joint email accounts. If only one can access the information, then it becomes like a "secret" and doesn't feel right to them.

I understand the desire, mostly rooted in emotional considerations, but I'm not sure as there is an answer. Perhaps the women should write to the General Relief Society Presidency to persuade the Brethren.

There is one more where both work and pay tithing separately and when tithing comes for the wife - men, who are clerks, apply the tithing check to the man's name. Even if the checking account only has her name on it, even if the slip is filled out with her name on it, they ignore all of that and associate it with the husband. I know this affected my mother as long as 40 years ago.

johnshaw wrote:There is one more where both work and pay tithing separately and when tithing comes for the wife - men, who are clerks, apply the tithing check to the man's name. Even if the checking account only has her name on it, even if the slip is filled out with her name on it, they ignore all of that and associate it with the husband. I know this affected my mother as long as 40 years ago.

Although I know this can sometimes be a problem, it's simply a training issue and can be worked out, just like any other mistakes made by imperfect clerks.

But I don't see how this particular issue is a problem related to the issue of using separate LDS Accounts for making donations. If anything, the issue you're raising is improved by the new donation system.

eblood66 wrote:That's not true. Because we moved last year we received two tax statements for 2014, one from our current ward and one generated by CHQ. Both statements had both my and my wife's names.

Looking at the thread I linked to, I see that question never got resolved. One was reporting the feature was gone, others said it was still there.

In the online donations under Settings there is an option for 'Display spouse name' with this note below it

When this box is checked, your spouse's name will display on all donor statements and donation slips. (NOTE: While your spouse's name may appear on donation slips and statements, donations are recorded to individual membership records.)

jonesrk wrote:In the online donations under Settings there is an option for 'Display spouse name' with this note below it

That certainly helps in the first case I mentioned. But it still keeps transactions "hidden" from the spouse.

It states in preferences, just below a box to check, the following.

When this box is checked, your spouse'’s name will be displayed along with yours on all donor statements and donation slips.
(Note: Although your spouse's name will appear on donation slips and statements, donations are recorded to individual membership records.)

Just to make it clear, when the check box is checked:

• Name and MRN of both spouse's appear on all forms

• shows the source as ward or online donation on all forms

• the donation amount of each spouse appears on my 2014 "---Tax summary statement"

• Both spouses names appear with each MRN, on the donation slip (Online white & yellow)

Is this statement correct? It is what I observe on my personal statement and slip.
However on on the "Donation History" and " Donor Statement of Contributions" (seems to be year to date.) my spouse's online donations are not listed, but the ward donations, of my spouse are.

I assume that this has to do with how the donations were entered into MLS?

1968leocomeeatabite wrote:Just to make it clear, when the check box is checked:

• Name and MRN of both spouse's appear on all forms

Only for the forms printed from that account. It does not pull in information from the spouse's account. In short, all it does is add the spouse's name - it does not change the report itself (the numbers) in any way.

Now, if it was me and I had donations in two different accounts, I'd leave that box unchecked. And here's why: If you ever got audited by the IRS, I think it might be difficult to explain why you have two reports with both names and different amounts. Unless it can be explained, the auditor might only accept one of the statements and reject the other as a duplicate. (At least that would be my concern.)

If each one had just the donor's name, the auditor isn't likely to make a fuss over it and accept the sum of the two statements for tax purposes.

the donation amount of each spouse appears on my 2014 "---Tax summary statement"

Would you please explain then why both spouse's donations appear on my 2014 ---Tax Summary Statement ?
Also, then I suspect that for the 2015 tax statement that the spouses donation amounts will not appear?

1968leocomeeatabite wrote:Would you please explain then why both spouse's donations appear on my 2014 ---Tax Summary Statement ?
Also, then I suspect that for the 2015 tax statement that the spouses donation amounts will not appear?

You really want to find out, uncheck that box and run the report again. I think you'll find all donations listed was applied only to one person.

If it really combined two people, that would be functionality we've never seen before.

From the Online Donation FAQS:

Q8. Why can’t I see my spouse’s donations when I log into Online Donations?

A8. For legal and privacy reasons, donations are recorded under individual membership records. However, your spouse’s name can be displayed on reports. Go to Settings, and, under Preferences, click the Display spouse name check box. Your spouse would need to log into Online Donations using their LDS Account in order to see donations recorded under their member record number. Likewise, you cannot see your spouse’s donations, but your name can appear on his or her donation slips and reports if they check Display spouse name.

1968leocomeeatabite wrote:Just to make it clear, when the check box is checked:

• the donation amount of each spouse appears on my 2014 "---Tax summary statement"

However on the "Donation History" and " Donor Statement of Contributions" (seems to be year to date.) my spouse's online donations are not listed, but the ward donations, of my spouse are.

I assume that this has to do with how the donations were entered into MLS?

I would guess that your ward clerk has recorded donations from both you and your spouse under your name in MLS. This would cause all of those donations to show up on your 2014 summary.

If you and your spouse each have contributed via Online Donations, the donations of one of you would not show up on the other summary.

So, if I'm understanding this correctly, the Church's records for online donations will be in either the husband's or the wife's name, but not both. Am I right? My husband and I have a joint checking account, but I handle the bills. If I want to split the amounts we donate right down the middle -- half to be applied under my name and half to be applied under his name, I cannot do this online. Correct?

And at tithing settlement, we could both claim to be full tithe payers, even though the Church records only show one of us as having made a donation?

Katzpur wrote:So, if I'm understanding this correctly, the Church's records for online donations will be in either the husband's or the wife's name, but not both. Am I right? My husband and I have a joint checking account, but I handle the bills. If I want to split the amounts we donate right down the middle -- half to be applied under my name and half to be applied under his name, I cannot do this online. Correct?

You cannot do that yourself online. You'd have to do your donations and your husband would have to do his.

However, you can go into the Settings option on the Donations screen online and check the box to display your spouses name. This won't change which donations show up in which account but when you print the donation reports and tax statements both names will be included on the reports.

Katzpur wrote:And at tithing settlement, we could both claim to be full tithe payers, even though the Church records only show one of us as having made a donation?

Most certainly. Even when you donate jointly using a check or cash to your local unit, the donation is actually only recorded on one account. The clerk just checks the same check box (but in MLS system on the church computer) to display both names on reports. So it is very common for a couple to both declare as full tithe payers even though the donations are linked to only one of the two.

Unless you're contemplating a divorce or filing taxes separately(in which case you'd want to keep the accounting separate), I don't think it makes a bit of difference as to which account is used to make the donation. It certainly makes no difference to the church or your standing in the church.

We have a new widow in the ward and after recording the death of her spouse we no longer are able to get a printout of his charitable contributions. Since she doesn't have access to her husband's account what is the best way to get her the information for tax purposes? It seems like we need access to these records. As was stated earlier in the thread it would be nice if someone could log in and give permission for someone else to view their contributions.

brucepayne wrote:We have a new widow in the ward and after recording the death of her spouse we no longer are able to get a printout of his charitable contributions. Since she doesn't have access to her husband's account what is the best way to get her the information for tax purposes? It seems like we need access to these records. As was stated earlier in the thread it would be nice if someone could log in and give permission for someone else to view their contributions.

The ward should still be able to print a record of any donations made in that ward. In MLS this is done by printing a Donor report or a Tax Statement. In LCR, you would use the Participants tab to print his donations (you may have to check the 'Include the "Out of Unit" participants' in order to see his entry). It may be possible to generate a tax statement in LCR but I can't verify that. If you can't generate a tax statement for him then you should contact Local Unit Support and ask how to get his tax statement.

This is definitely an emotional problem. My husband and I have ALWAYS paid our donations together. Now since it can only be under one name I feel out of order to put it in my name even though I take care of the finances. I have always respected my husband's priesthood and recognize his alzheimers status shouldn't be an issue. What is the proper thing to do?

The question of what is the "proper" thing to do in difficult circumstances is not always easily answered. I would suggest getting the counsel of your bishop or other local priesthood leaders, because they will have the inspiration to best advise with your particular situation.

At the risk of perhaps going a little outside the usual bounds of technology-related issues that are the charter of this forum, I would be inclined to do what works best on a practical basis. As a matter of my personal opinion, if my wife handled our family finances, I would not consider it disrespectful for her to do the donations in her name if that is what worked best.

rmrichesjr wrote:The question of what is the "proper" thing to do in difficult circumstances is not always easily answered. I would suggest getting the counsel of your bishop or other local priesthood leaders, because they will have the inspiration to best advise with your particular situation.

However, wither they realize it or not, they will be constrained by the limitations listed above - it can only be under one name but print outs can list both.

rmrichesjr wrote:I would be inclined to do what works best on a practical basis.

Something to consider, if the husband passes away, his LDS Account will be deactivated. There is another message were a sister is having problems getting access to the donation history after the husband passed away. You can always set your account to display "your" donations on his account.

jackyg wrote:can I access my donation records for 2016 at this site?

Go to LDS.org and select Donations in the middle column of the drop down box under My Account and Ward, which will also have your name by it if you are signed in. If you go there directly from here, you should not have to sign in again, but if you go there later and are not signed in, you will be taken to the sign in page on the way to the Donation page.

Once at the Donations page, you have your choice on the left side either to view your Donation History or to access your actual Donation Reports.