Out of Unit Leader Photos

With the new LDS Tools app I'm able to take photos of members/leaders of the Stake and have them uploaded right?

How can I get photos of our YSA Stake Leadership uploaded to the Directory so that Members of the Stake can see them?

Out of unit leaders need to have their photos uploaded either by themselves or by an administrator in their home ward.

jdlessley wrote:Out of unit leaders need to have their photos uploaded either by themselves or by an administrator in their home ward.

And if they are uploaded by themselves, they have to be approved by an administrator in their home ward before they will be visible.

They are out of unit members so no information from their home ward is synced with the Unit that they are serving in. Any information that is in our YSA Stake Directory for Out of Unit Members I've manually put in. In fact if I print a IOS for one of the Out of Unit Leaders it shows the Stake as their Ward so I don't know who or how to approve the photo taken for our directory . . .

A proper out-of-unit member will have a MRN in their record. They only way these leaders can get access is if they have a MRN. The MRN connects them to their home ward at the lds.org level (but not the MLS level).

Yes they have their MRN in their out of unit record but when I login for example the Stake Presidents photo isn't shown but when he logs into his home ward directory it's there . . .

CSnelson wrote: but when he logs into his home ward directory it's there . . .

Has it been approved? What privacy settings have be set on it?

I'm in a YSA Stake. I serve as an assistant stake clerk.

I used lds.org/leader to go through each ward in my stake and see what each leader's home ward is. It will list a unit name and number.

Then I go to cdol.lds.org and search for that unit number which gives me the Ward Clerk's contact information for each of the 57 out-of-unit leaders in our stake. Some of them are in the same wards, which is nice, so there aren't 57 home wards to contact--it's more like 50.

I added all of that information to a spreadsheet where I'm keeping track of which leaders I've taken pictures of, which leaders I've helped upload their photos to the online directory, and which photos are actually visible in the online directory (and if they are visible in the online directory, they should be pushed to the LDSTools app as well.)

The next thing I have to do is contact all of these Home Ward Clerks and train them on how to login to lds.org, how to access the directory, and how to approve photos. Once I've trained them on how to do that, they will finally be able to approve the photo of the member in their ward who is serving as an out-of-unit leader in my stake.


I've been procrastinating doing all of this in the hopes that someone would finally make the directory let leaders approve their own photos. But it seems my hope has been in vain, so, I'll begin the long process of training leaders across the valley.

If anyone's got an idea on how to do this better, I'm all ears.

CSnelson wrote:Yes they have their MRN in their out of unit record but when I login for example the Stake Presidents photo isn't shown but when he logs into his home ward directory it's there . . .

When a member uploads a photo, they can always see their photo whether it has been approved or not. No one else, however, can see the photo they uploaded until it has been approved by a leader in their Home Ward. I use this feature to ensure that the photo was actually uploaded for each and every leader that I've been helping upload photos to lds.org/directory

cognifloyd wrote:The next thing I have to do is contact all of these Home Ward Clerks and train them on how to login to lds.org, how to access the directory, and how to approve photos. Once I've trained them on how to do that, they will finally be able to approve the photo of the member in their ward who is serving as an out-of-unit leader in my stake.

One idea that could simplify your task is to leverage the power of the stakes. You are an assistant stake clerk, and you take responsibility to help train all the ward clerks in your stake. Similarly, each stake that has members serving in your stake has a stake clerk with assistants, all of whom have a responsibility to train their ward clerks. That way you'd only have to deal with perhaps 10 stake clerks instead of 50 ward clerks.

It's certainly possible that some of those stake clerks won't take your request seriously, but hopefully most of them will realize the value of having photos for their own stake members, and can expedite your request to get photos for a few of their members approved promptly.

cognifloyd wrote:I've been procrastinating doing all of this in the hopes that someone would finally make the directory let leaders approve their own photos. But it seems my hope has been in vain, so, I'll begin the long process of training leaders across the valley.

The problem, of course, is that these people are not leaders in the ward that has responsibility for approving the photos (their home ward); if they were leaders there, they could already approve the photos. So I think your hope is indeed in vain (or at least a very low priority).

So there is no way for me to take a photo of my stake president and upload it and have it approved by him or anyone else in our stake for at least our YSA stake?

CSnelson wrote:So there is no way for me to take a photo of my stake president and upload it and have it approved by him or anyone else in our stake for at least our YSA stake?

That's correct. His membership records are not in your stake, and therefore you have no jurisdiction over approving his photo. That responsibility lies with his home ward, where his membership records are.

Is there a reason why there isn't a stake level administrator that can approve photos?

CSnelson wrote:Is there a reason why there isn't a stake level administrator that can approve photos?

I don't know; that's just the way it was implemented. But that particular issue has nothing to do with YSA stakes -- even stake level clerks and leaders in regular stakes can't do anything with photos.

Yeah I realize that it has nothing to do with this particular issue but at the same time it kinda does because we have feeder stakes for leadership and it would be nice to be able to just call up the clerk of those ten or so stakes and get it taken care of instead of each leader having to go ask their home ward clerk to take care of it.

I am wondering what the likelihood is for letting the ward website administrator in a YSA ward approve photos for their own out-of-unit leader photos. Surely there should be a way that MLS could "find" the leader and identify them with the ward, considering that they show up in the ward leadership section. Is there a simple programming fix that would allow their names to appear as options in the photo upload section if said names are identified in the leadership section? This would save a lot of time as I do not have time to try to find and contact the names of the home ward website administrator for each of the members of our bishopric. We would like to have the photos accessible for new members to become more familiar with the bishopric more quickly. Thank you for considering this!

ehallmark wrote:I am wondering what the likelihood is for letting the ward website administrator in a YSA ward approve photos for their own out-of-unit leader photos.

This is possible. But programming to permit one unit to edit membership records in another unit may be required. Or programming that allows a photo to be linked to a temporary record would be needed. I think the second option is the best choice. I am sure they are working on a solution. We just don't know what it is or when it will be deployed.

ehallmark wrote:Surely there should be a way that MLS could "find" the leader and identify them with the ward, considering that they show up in the ward leadership section.

Leaders serving as out of unit members have a temporary record created in the unit MLS for the unit they are serving in. That temporary record is not linked for update purposes to their permanent record. Any changes made to the temporary record only reside within the service unit's MLS.

ehallmark wrote:Is there a simple programming fix that would allow their names to appear as options in the photo upload section if said names are identified in the leadership section?

I don't know the complexity of any programming required to link a photo to a temporary record. Currently photos can only be linked to permanent records. A solution to this issue would benefit other temporary record photo situations such as for nonmember spouses.

jdlessley wrote:I don't know the complexity of any programming required to link a photo to a temporary record. Currently photos can only be linked to permanent records. A solution to this issue would benefit other temporary record photo situations such as for nonmember spouses.

If temporary records had their own data synced to LDS.org it would also allow bishops to put preferred contact info for their members vs. their home ward – for example, a bishop might have an email address "ward-bishop-123@example.com" for his members to email him where he's serving, and a different email address for his home ward members to contact him...

sbradshaw wrote:

jdlessley wrote:I don't know the complexity of any programming required to link a photo to a temporary record. Currently photos can only be linked to permanent records. A solution to this issue would benefit other temporary record photo situations such as for nonmember spouses.

If temporary records had their own data synced to LDS.org it would also allow bishops to put preferred contact info for their members vs. their home ward – for example, a bishop might have an email address "ward-bishop-123@example.com" for his members to email him where he's serving, and a different email address for his home ward members to contact him...

Actually he can have a different email for his calling in CDOL than he has in lds.org directory for his home ward.

JonesRK wrote:

sbradshaw wrote:

jdlessley wrote:I don't know the complexity of any programming required to link a photo to a temporary record. Currently photos can only be linked to permanent records. A solution to this issue would benefit other temporary record photo situations such as for nonmember spouses.

If temporary records had their own data synced to LDS.org it would also allow bishops to put preferred contact info for their members vs. their home ward – for example, a bishop might have an email address "ward-bishop-123@example.com" for his members to email him where he's serving, and a different email address for his home ward members to contact him...

Actually he can have a different email for his calling in CDOL than he has in lds.org directory for his home ward.

That's true, but the members of his ward won't be able to look up his email on CDOL...

The practical solution is to reverse the out-of-unit membership record between the assigned and home units.

If you create an out-of-unit record in the assigned unit, that record only resides on the assigned unit's computer. So the individual's name will not appear in the online (LDS.org) directory of the assigned unit. Also, the individual will not be able to see any online info about the youth and children in the assigned unit. For example, if the individual is called to serve the YW in the assigned unit, the individual will not have access to the online tools that she needs to do her duties in the assigned unit. When she logs into the Personal Progress website, she will see the records of the YW in her home unit rather than the YW in the assigned unit.

On the other hand, the intent of keeping the individual's membership record in the home unit is for the individual to make donations in the home unit, to receive HT & VT from the home unit, and to renew the individual's temple recommend in the home unit.

The purposes above can be accomplished by creating an out-of-unit record in the home unit rather than the assigned unit. To accomplish the desired results, the tasks below must be completed by the home unit clerk in the following order:

(1) Print a copy of the individual's membership record.
(2) Annotate the printed record with the names of the HT & VT.
(3) Then transfer the membership record to the assigned unit.
(4) After sending the record, create an out-of-unit membership record in the home unit's computer using the data on the printed membership record. Be sure to enter the ordinance and temple recommend info so that the individual does not appear on any action lists as a nonmember, unordained male, unendowed adult, endowed adult without a temple recommend, etc.
(5) Then enter the HT & VT assignments.

jagflynn@hotmail.com

jagflynn wrote:On the other hand, the intent of keeping the individual's membership record in the home unit is for the individual to make donations in the home unit, to receive HT & VT from the home unit, and to renew the individual's temple recommend in the home unit.

The purposes above can be accomplished by creating an out-of-unit record in the home unit rather than the assigned unit.

In order for the home stake to activate a temple recommend the member's record must be in their home ward. So this solution does not allow for that.

jagflynn wrote:The practical solution is to reverse the out-of-unit membership record between the assigned and home units.
...
To accomplish the desired results, the tasks below must be completed by the home unit clerk in the following order:

I don't see how that's practical at all. The list of tasks to be completed by the home unit clerk is far longer than simply uploading an updated photo. So the cure is much worse than the original problem. I'd suggest that it's better to follow the published guidelines, leaving the family records intact in the home ward, and have the home ward clerk upload the photo.

jagflynn wrote:The practical solution is to reverse the out-of-unit membership record between the assigned and home units.

Why would this be practical?

jagflynn wrote:If you create an out-of-unit record in the assigned unit, that record only resides on the assigned unit's computer.

Correct that is how its to work the member is not an official member of the unit, they have been assigned temporally to the unit, in most cases they are assigned to the Bishopric of a YSA ward or to a stake leadership position in a YSA stake. An out of unit member record needs to be created to enable them to accomplish the responsibilities in the assigned unit.

jagflynn wrote:So the individual's name will not appear in the online (LDS.org) directory of the assigned unit.

I'm not sure if this is correct or not. However since I have no way of checking this out I will have to take your ward for it. On the other hand in the single adult ward in my stake the Bishopric members all appear on the YSA wards directory and not in the home unit directory, but I think this is because their records were actually moved to the YSA ward and not done as an out-of-unit record.

jagflynn wrote:Also, the individual will not be able to see any online info about the youth and children in the assigned unit. For example, if the individual is called to serve the YW in the assigned unit, the individual will not have access to the online tools that she needs to do her duties in the assigned unit. When she logs into the Personal Progress website, she will see the records of the YW in her home unit rather than the YW in the assigned unit.

This should be no big deal since most out-of-unit records are for Leadership in YSA wards and only the Bishopric members in a YSA Ward should be holding callings within the ward. As well as the obvious and that is YSA wards don't have children or YW in their wards.

jagflynn wrote:On the other hand, the intent of keeping the individual's membership record in the home unit is for the individual to make donations in the home unit, to receive HT & VT from the home unit, and to renew the individual's temple recommend in the home unit.

Not really the intent is because the Bishop of the home ward is responsible for all members living within their ward boundaries and he has the stewardship over those member even when there calling is assigned outside of their home ward.

jagflynn wrote:So the individual's name will not appear in the online (LDS.org) directory of the assigned unit.

I'm not sure that's true for a leader.

jagflynn wrote:For example, if the individual is called to serve the YW in the assigned unit, the individual will not have access to the online tools that she needs to do her duties in the assigned unit. When she logs into the Personal Progress website, she will see the records of the YW in her home unit rather than the YW in the assigned unit.

YW? I'm at a loss to think of why an out of unit leader is needed for YW. That would be a most unusual situation. Most of the time the out-of-unit leader is for a Student or YSA ward.

I'll also point out that your suggestion to move the record to the served ward is at odds with the Handbook.

The out of unit members (sr. couples assigned by the stake as bishopric or sr. missionaries) in our YSA ward do not show up in the list of members on LDS.org even though they each have an out of unit record. This includes the bishopric.
On LDS.org
1. The bishopric and clerk do show up as leaders under Ward Leaders if it is selected on the LDS.org directory.
2. Under the Ward Leaders section of LDS.org directory there is no way to add photos of the Bishopric and Clerk since they are all out of unit.
3. Since the sr couples do not show up in the households I cannot assign photos to them.
On LDS Tools
1. The sr. couples do show up by name in LDS tools Directory where the wife's name is in the list as part of the husband's listing as "Doe, John & Jane."
2. If I select a couple the household section only lists the husband as a houshold member.

I want to:
1. Have the sr. couples and bishopric show up as households in the directory on LDS.org directory
2. Add photos for all of the sr. couples and bishopric on LDS.org
3. Add photos for all of the sr. couples and bishopric for LDS tools.

Thanks

Miknmaur wrote:The out of unit members (sr. couples assigned by the stake as bishopric or sr. missionaries) in our YSA ward do not show up in the list of members on LDS.org even though they each have an out of unit record. This includes the bishopric.

The out of unit record is only in your local copy of MLS, so nothing at CHQ knows about it. The one thing it does for you that affects data at CHQ is that you can then put those people in callings in MLS. Those callings do go to CHQ (CDOL) and can affect other parts of LDS.org.

All of the Sr. missionaries are assigned callings as ward missionaries so that they can see the ward website. Half of them are from another stake.
So adding photos for OOU folks is not in the plan? I think that is not a good plan, the YSAs need to be able to put a face to a name for all of us old folks hanging around.

Miknmaur wrote:All of the Sr. missionaries are assigned callings as ward missionaries so that they can see the ward website. Half of them are from another stake.
So adding photos for OOU folks is not in the plan? I think that is not a good plan, the YSAs need to be able to put a face to a name for all of us old folks hanging around.

Photos can be added but they have to be done in the person's home ward. Once they are added in the home ward they should show up in the YSA ward. For proselyting missionaries the mission office can add their photos as well.

Based on what I know of the internal CHQ architecture (which is admittedly second hand) adding the ability for wards to add photos for out of unit leaders is probably a fair amount of work. Given the reductions in the teams working on the website tools, I expect it will be a while even if the priesthood authorities decide it should be done.

The counselor in the bishopric in the YSA ward that resides in my stake (the YSA ward is in a different stake) can see my photo on the YSA directory under ward leaders/bishopric but the counselor from the other stake where the YSA ward is part cannot see my picture. The counselor from the same stake as the YSA ward is going to upload his picture on his ward website and we will see what happens.

Miknmaur wrote:The counselor in the bishopric in the YSA ward that resides in my stake (the YSA ward is in a different stake) can see my photo on the YSA directory under ward leaders/bishopric but the counselor from the other stake where the YSA ward is part cannot see my picture. The counselor from the same stake as the YSA ward is going to upload his picture on his ward website and we will see what happens.

You might want to verify that the photo has been approved. If it hasn't been approved only some people can see it.

Miknmaur wrote:The counselor in the bishopric in the YSA ward that resides in my stake (the YSA ward is in a different stake) can see my photo on the YSA directory under ward leaders/bishopric but the counselor from the other stake where the YSA ward is part cannot see my picture. The counselor from the same stake as the YSA ward is going to upload his picture on his ward website and we will see what happens.

Make sure that all pictures have been approved by a clerk or bishopric member in their home ward. Otherwise there may be visibility issues. Also you may want to make sure that their visibility settings are set to Stake (the most visible). I don't know how the visibility settings affect things for out-of-unit leaders but there could be an effect.