zeroing out an "Other" sub account

We have a small negative balance in an "Other" sub account which I want to clear by transferring money from a budget account. It seem the only way is to write a check on budget and then deposit it in the "Othe" account. If there is an easier way, I would appreciate a how to response. Thanks.

Carl wrote:We have a small negative balance in an "Other" sub account which I want to clear by transferring money from a budget account. It seem the only way is to write a check on budget and then deposit it in the "Othe" account. If there is an easier way, I would appreciate a how to response. Thanks.

That's the way to do it. To quote the Record Keeping Training lesson titled "Understanding and Using the "Other" Category":

To transfer funds from a budget subcategory to an “Other” subcategory, print a check from the appropriate budget subcategory payable to the unit. Then deposit the check into the “Other” subcategory using a Tithing and Other Offerings slip in the name of the unit. Make sure that you make the deposit in the appropriate “Other” subcategory so that it will clear to zero.

While writing a check is a viable option, it is preferable to review the "income and expense report", click on "all" on that subcategory and determine by reviewing the history what prompted the negative balance in the first place. It is always the best solution where possible to trace the problem to the source and then correct the source item. This option provides an audit trail. Writing a check from budget does not provide that audit trail.

bboy wrote:While writing a check is a viable option, it is preferable to review the "income and expense report", click on "all" on that subcategory and determine by reviewing the history what prompted the negative balance in the first place. It is always the best solution where possible to trace the problem to the source and then correct the source item. This option provides an audit trail. Writing a check from budget does not provide that audit trail.

It is certainly sound advice to determine the cause of the issue. When I gave my response, I assumed this had been done. But you raise a good point that this should indeed be done first.

However, there are certainly situations where the correct course of action is to write a check from Budget. An example would be where a check is written from Other for the cost of a YW camp, assuming that the girls will earn the money themselves, but then it turns out that one girl can't really afford it, so the bishop decides to pay for that portion from Budget funds.

In any case, it is certainly not true that writing a check from budget fails to leave an audit trail. Any check that is written leaves a very clear audit trail, since the documentation for the check will have to explain why the check was written. Also, the deposited funds will show that the donor is the ward, so that obviously came from a check, which is easily traced.

Alan_Brown wrote:That's the way to do it. To quote the Record Keeping Training lesson titled "Understanding and Using the "Other" Category":

I inherited a very poorly run Financial Clerk calling in our ward about a year and half ago. The 'Other' account showed a negative amount and I have not been able to really concentrate on it until recently. A few months ago I was given the Ward Clerk calling so I have been try to train our new Finance Clerk but he is too busy with Tithing right now so I am trying to get a handle on the 'Other' account.

I show some Other subcategories with positive amounts and four subcategories with negative amounts. I have gone back three years to try and determine what the money was to be used for but have come to the sad conclusion that money was being moved in and out of Budget categories and between Other account subcategories.

My understanding is that I am NOT allowed to transfer money from the Other account(s) to Budget categories. Is this correct? If so, can I move money from Other categories that show positive amounts to Other categories that show negative amounts? If not, then what do I do with the money in the Other subcategories that show a positive amount? How do I balance the four categories that show negative amounts? (I would think I would need to write a check from Budget - Ward Administration to zero out the balances).

Sorry about all the questions...this has been really frustrating me and I am determined to solve this problem by years end. Thank you.

cdawardclerk wrote:I inherited a very poorly run Financial Clerk calling in our ward about a year and half ago. The 'Other' account showed a negative amount and I have not been able to really concentrate on it until recently. A few months ago I was given the Ward Clerk calling so I have been try to train our new Finance Clerk but he is too busy with Tithing right now so I am trying to get a handle on the 'Other' account.

I show some Other subcategories with positive amounts and four subcategories with negative amounts. I have gone back three years to try and determine what the money was to be used for but have come to the sad conclusion that money was being moved in and out of Budget categories and between Other account subcategories.

My understanding is that I am NOT allowed to transfer money from the Other account(s) to Budget categories. Is this correct? If so, can I move money from Other categories that show positive amounts to Other categories that show negative amounts? If not, then what do I do with the money in the Other subcategories that show a positive amount? How do I balance the four categories that show negative amounts? (I would think I would need to write a check from Budget - Ward Administration to zero out the balances).

You have done the first step in looking back as far as you can to understand how a subcategory of Other happened to have a nonzero balance. If the accounting was done properly (unfortunately in this case that seems not to be true), a positive balance would indicate that members overpaid for whatever the specific purpose of the Other subcategory was, so the money should be refunded. A negative balance would indicate that more money needs to be collected from the members who received the benefit, or Budget funds have to be used to make up the difference.

If you can't sort out the problems because the source of the problems is too far back, then I would think that it is okay to transfer money among the Other subcategories to try to zero out as many as possible. This is generally not a good practice, but since the Other category is so unreliable in your case, it seems silly to reimburse negative subcategory balances from Budget, only to then have positive subcategory balances that you then have to somehow deal with.

Alan_Brown wrote:You have done the first step in looking back as far as you can to understand how a subcategory of Other happened to have a nonzero balance. If the accounting was done properly (unfortunately in this case that seems not to be true), a positive balance would indicate that members overpaid for whatever the specific purpose of the Other subcategory was, so the money should be refunded. A negative balance would indicate that more money needs to be collected from the members who received the benefit, or Budget funds have to be used to make up the difference.

If you can't sort out the problems because the source of the problems is too far back, then I would think that it is okay to transfer money among the Other subcategories to try to zero out as many as possible. This is generally not a good practice, but since the Other category is so unreliable in your case, it seems silly to reimburse negative subcategory balances from Budget, only to then have positive subcategory balances that you then have to somehow deal with.

I would rather not have to transfer between subcategories but I also agree with you on that the source of these problems are more than three years old. What is the method of transferring funds between subcategories? Thank you Alan.

Alan_Brown wrote:If you can't sort out the problems because the source of the problems is too far back, then I would think that it is okay to transfer money among the Other subcategories to try to zero out as many as possible. This is generally not a good practice, but since the Other category is so unreliable in your case, it seems silly to reimburse negative subcategory balances from Budget, only to then have positive subcategory balances that you then have to somehow deal with.

Before you do as Alan recommends here I would call Church headquarters before moving funds around within the "Other" category. Sometimes the more painful process is the more correct process in rectifying "Other" account issues. Unless Church headquarters directs you to move funds within the "Other" category sub-accounts you may end up with more problems.

Getting as much an understanding of the problems as far back as you can go is best before calling headquarters. For one ward in our stake, headquarters wanted us to go all the way back to when the ward converted from FIS to MLS - which was in 2004.

The advice you've received is good, but the very first thing I'd do is to make sure none of the debts from the Other account are from bounced donation checks. If a member's check bounces, the amount of the check is taken out of the other account by Church Headquarters until the ward can properly cancel the donation. Since that has a direct affect on tithing settlement, that's the thing I'd do first. (Note, I don't think this will show up automatically in MLS)

The other thing you need to look at is to reconcile what MLS says is in the Other account with the bank statements. If the past Financial clerk wasn't doing his job, what's in MLS may have no reflection on reality. When all is said and done, MLS is kind of like Quicken - a fancy check register/accounting system. It's there to help you do your job, but the actual bank statement is the true "bottom line".

jdlessley wrote:Before you do as Alan recommends here I would call Church headquarters before moving funds around within the "Other" category. Sometimes the more painful process is the more correct process in rectifying "Other" account issues. Unless Church headquarters directs you to move funds within the "Other" category sub-accounts you may end up with more problems.

Getting as much an understanding of the problems as far back as you can go is best before calling headquarters. For one ward in our stake, headquarters wanted us to go all the way back to when the ward converted from FIS to MLS - which was in 2004.

I have called CHQ...they helped me with a couple of returned checks with helped to reduce our negative balance. I cannot determine or identify amounts or individuals that have contributed because many of these transaction go back more than three years. I don't see how much more painful it could be to try and zero out the subcategories with negative balances with funds from those subcategories with positive amounts.

I think our prior clerks mistakenly used budget funds to pay for activities. Also they did not reconcile statements.

cdawardclerk wrote:What is the method of transferring funds between subcategories?

Before doing any transfers you should make sure there are no errors in donations or expenses with regard to categories. If so, you should correct the donation or expense. For example, if a missionary expense was written from the Ward Missionary account, but should have been written from the "Ward Missionary:Elder Joseph Jones" subcategory, just go to that expense (View/Update Expenses) and correct the subcategory.

Category corrections can even be made across major categories, which will generate an MLS message that is sent to CHQ, requesting that the appropriate funds be transferred. When you do this, make sure that you verify that the funds have actually been transferred. CHQ will send you a confirmation message back through the MLS messaging system. However, sometimes they have questions or require additional documentation, so don't just assume that the transfer has happened until you get a confirmation or see it appear on your CUFS.


Once you have done all the research you can, and made appropriate corrections, to transfer funds between subcategories within a major category (such as Other), the simplest way is to create a transfer. To do that in MLS, go to the Finances screen and choose Enter Transfers. Then:

• Enter a comment that describes why you are transferring the funds.
• On the Left side, specify the subcategory you are transferring from, and enter the amount
• On the Right side, specify the subcategory you are transferring to, and enter the same amount
• The Left and Right sides (Source and Destination) must have the same totals.
• Click Save

If you need to transfer funds between major categories (for example, from Budget to Other), you have to write a check. Make the check out to your own unit and write it from the proper source subcategory. Then deposit it as part of a normal batch into the appropriate destination subcategory.

cdawardclerk wrote:I think our prior clerks mistakenly used budget funds to pay for activities.

I hope that "budget" was a typo and you meant to say "Other". With very few exceptions, it is required to use Budget funds to pay for activities, so it's not a mistake to use Budget funds. "Other" account funds are used only when funds have been given to the ward for a specific purpose (Magazine subscriptions, for example) and then are paid out for that same specific purpose. Also, for one annual camp, if budget funds are insufficient to cover the cost, youth may earn part or all of the cost of the camp and equipment, or authorized fund-raising activities may help with the cost of that one camp.

Tracking funds earned by youth or through fund-raising should be tracked through the Other account. But all other ward activities are paid for through budget funds.

cdawardclerk wrote:Also they did not reconcile statements.

You are learning the painful lesson that failure to reconcile statements promptly can lead to a host of ever-increasing problems. You've got a big job ahead of you to bring your accounts into balance, but once you do so, you will find that problems are far less frequent and much easier to fix.

Alan_Brown wrote:I hope that "budget" was a typo and you meant to say "Other". With very few exceptions, it is required to use Budget funds to pay for activities, so it's not a mistake to use Budget funds. "Other" account funds are used only when funds have been given to the ward for a specific purpose (Magazine subscriptions, for example) and then are paid out for that same specific purpose. Also, for one annual camp, if budget funds are insufficient to cover the cost, youth may earn part or all of the cost of the camp and equipment, or authorized fund-raising activities may help with the cost of that one camp.

Tracking funds earned by youth or through fund-raising should be tracked through the Other account. But all other ward activities are paid for through budget funds.



You are learning the painful lesson that failure to reconcile statements promptly can lead to a host of ever-increasing problems. You've got a big job ahead of you to bring your accounts into balance, but once you do so, you will find that problems are far less frequent and much easier to fix.

No, this was no typo. As best as I can tell this is what happened. I do know and understand what you are saying...this is why I am having trouble with the Other account and why I think your suggestion to transfer funds to zero out the negative subcategories is a good one.

When I started my calling I started with Jan2005 Financial Statement to Reconcile as recommended by CHQ. So I reconciled 2 1/2 years of statements just to catch up. That's why I did not have the time to clear up the Other account...however I was reconciling the Other account using MLS.

Yes it is a painful lesson...but I don't understand why there was no corrective action taken prior to me being called. Talk about inheriting a 'can of worms'!

Thanks for your help. I will get this solved.

RussellHltn wrote:The advice you've received is good, but the very first thing I'd do is to make sure none of the debts from the Other account are from bounced donation checks. If a member's check bounces, the amount of the check is taken out of the other account by Church Headquarters until the ward can properly cancel the donation. Since that has a direct affect on tithing settlement, that's the thing I'd do first. (Note, I don't think this will show up automatically in MLS)

The other thing you need to look at is to reconcile what MLS says is in the Other account with the bank statements. If the past Financial clerk wasn't doing his job, what's in MLS may have no reflection on reality. When all is said and done, MLS is kind of like Quicken - a fancy check register/accounting system. It's there to help you do your job, but the actual bank statement is the true "bottom line".

Yes, I've found 2 returned checks. Thank you.

I've been reconcilling the Financial Statements for about a year and a half. I haven't had the time to fix the Other account until recently as I am now Ward Clerk and training a new finance clerk.